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> Bacterial Vaginosis--or--embarrassing bad smell
lori
post Jun 19 2007, 01:11 AM
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QUOTE(sassy @ Jun 18 2007, 12:47 PM) *
Lori: Since you seem to be the expert, I thought I would ask you this. With all of these other infections you mention, some that can be caused by the antibiotics, and others that are sort of unexplained (ex-mycroplasa), how do we know if we really have BV? What should I ask for my doctor to do the next time I go to make sure I'm not suffering from one of these other infections? How are they supposed to be treated when some doctors aren't even aware of them? Ahh...I'm so confused! sad.gif

Oh no, I'm not an expert. Sorry if I sound like a "know-it-all cunt" sometimes. tongue.gif I'm just trying to share information that I learned, some of which is from members in this very thread! I'm just trying to piece it all together in a way that makes sense - to me, anyway. (Trust me, I'm confused, too!)

So to "regurgitate" from The V Book:
  • strep - is diagnosed by a microscope - where you can see "little round streptococci lined up in chains"
  • mobiluncus - under the microcope, you can see "mobiliuncus tumbling across the slide"
  • desquamative inflammatory vagintis (DIV) - this is basically when everything else has been ruled out
Dr. Stewart says that these are a "challenge" to diagnose. Isn't that great?

Strep and Mobiluncus are rare, but both are typically caused by the antibiotics we use for BV. They are considered "superinfection" - because you are not being attacked by an outside bacteria, you're just dealing with an overgrowth of something that is always there, and isn't harmful in small amounts (just like yeast and BV).

I don't mean to muddy the waters and introduce a lot of far-fetched ideas in here, taking everyone on some wild goose-chase. But since many of us have taken these antibiotics many times, and our symptoms recur so often - I think it's something that should at least be on our radars. Especially when the symptoms are unusual - as in Morphia's case, she has no odor. That's definitely unusual, because the one thing *everyone* complains about in here is the nasty stench.

There are other possibilities as well - e.g., vulvodynia. Or it could be just other skin conditions such as lichen or eczema. Those are apparently misdiagnosed all the time as a gyno problem when they really aren't.

As far as how to ask about it with your doctor - hopefully your doctor knows you've been dealing with this for a long time, and is receptive to discussions about these alternatives. Even Dr. Stewart (who wrote the V book) admits that she gets a lot of patients who complain that their gynos don't listen to them and treat them like idiots. Having experienced dumb doctors like that myself, I really know that feeling.

(I've even had one doctor snap at me, "Are you telling me how to do my job?" Seriously. And I just watched the movie Knocked Up this weekend, and there was a doctor who said that and it made me so mad! Asshole. The movie was funny, though.)

So I don't know what you should do. I would recommend that you get The V Book and read it yourself - don't rely on my excerpts. And if you're concerned about any of these, you should ask your doctor. Bring the book with you, maybe? Hopefully you have a good doctor who at least listens to you, or insurance that lets you find a better doctor if you want to switch.


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phobia
post Jun 18 2007, 04:22 PM
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Hi all! I am so psyched to find out about Yeast Arrest! I got some today -- I'd head about using boric acid to get rid of persistent yeasties, but was never sure where on earth to find it! I just have a quick question -- it says after the first 2-week period that you should use it for four days "during menstruation." How does this work if one uses, for example, menstrual cups? I was thinking I could wait till after my heavy-heavy flow days and do it at night whilst wearing a pad? Ideas?

Also -- I looked up the topic on PubMed, and the research cited in the Yeast Arrest says that a "full cure" for the yeast infection was achieved using 600 mg per day, but I noticed the Yeast Arrest is 600 mg/capsule, and it says to use 2 per day. I don't want to overdo it. Thoughts?

Again -- thanks sooo much for the tip. I've had bad luck with creams (the burning, you would not believe -- maybe an allergy???) or Diflucan, and it just. Keeps. Recurring. Keep your fingers crossed for me!!!!!
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ilovehim
post Jun 18 2007, 03:01 PM
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QUOTE(arj75 @ Jun 18 2007, 12:15 AM) *
I am SO GLAD ilovehim..isn't knocked up..and I hope she gets her skinny ass into the doctor VERY SOON!



What the fuck is wrong with you? You got some issues lady.


Question: Can I add water to the boric acid like a douche? Because I didn't have any capsules and this is what I did.Should I be worried?


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sassy
post Jun 18 2007, 01:30 PM
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Lori: Since you seem to be the expert, I thought I would ask you this. With all of these other infections you mention, some that can be caused by the antibiotics, and others that are sort of unexplained (ex-mycroplasa), how do we know if we really have BV? What should I ask for my doctor to do the next time I go to make sure I'm not suffering from one of these other infections? How are they supposed to be treated when some doctors aren't even aware of them? Ahh...I'm so confused! sad.gif
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Morphia
post Jun 18 2007, 01:13 PM
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QUOTE(arj75 @ Jun 18 2007, 07:21 AM) *
Morphia, how long have you been dealing with the burning issue? And where all does it "burn" inside and out? or just inside?
Is your vagina swollen?

I assume that you have switched laundry soaps, bath soaps, antiperspirant deodorants (that is a big can of worms that I would like to mention at some point),(as I'm sure most know that it has been linked to breast cancer) pads without perfume, and every other possible cause for this might being an allergy to something.

Do you use perfume?

This is just a "theory", of course I will look into it. If our bodies can absorb aluminum from the deodorants, then skin cells can absorb perfumes too??? (or at least increase risk for yeast infection?)

Lori, I wish I could tell you which one of my 5,834 changes I have made..as to which one worked. lol

P.S. The alkaline diet cookbooks are collecting dust. (But I still am interested in that)



I have burning on the inside. I know this is bv. Every time I have the Affirm test it always comes back showing that I have clinically significant levels of gardnerella bacteria in my discharge.

I already have The V Book. I ordered it a couple of months ago. It is a pretty good book.
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chantelhugo
post Jun 18 2007, 06:11 AM
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I'm not pregnant! haha, but it was a scare for a bit. Anyways, I bought the Yeast Arrest and will start any day...hope i could get success with that!
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arj75
post Jun 18 2007, 06:04 AM
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QUOTE(Morphia @ Jun 18 2007, 12:49 AM) *
Who here has bv with no odor? I still think its odd that I have such a persistent and virulent case of bv and it doesn't smell. I don't want to jinx myself here but I have to say its strange. No smell, it burns, yet it keeps coming up as gardnerella on the Affirm. The only text book symptom I have is the thin, pasty, white, bubbly dishcarge. Any theories?


Morphia, how long have you been dealing with the burning issue? And where all does it "burn" inside and out? or just inside?
Is your vagina swollen?

I assume that you have switched laundry soaps, bath soaps, antiperspirant deodorants (that is a big can of worms that I would like to mention at some point),(as I'm sure most know that it has been linked to breast cancer) pads without perfume, and every other possible cause for this might being an allergy to something.

Do you use perfume?

This is just a "theory", of course I will look into it. If our bodies can absorb aluminum from the deodorants, then skin cells can absorb perfumes too??? (or at least increase risk for yeast infection?)

Lori, I wish I could tell you which one of my 5,834 changes I have made..as to which one worked. lol

P.S. The alkaline diet cookbooks are collecting dust. (But I still am interested in that)
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lori
post Jun 18 2007, 05:59 AM
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QUOTE(Morphia @ Jun 17 2007, 10:49 PM) *
Who here has bv with no odor? I still think its odd that I have such a persistent and virulent case of bv and it doesn't smell. I don't want to jinx myself here but I have to say its strange. No smell, it burns, yet it keeps coming up as gardnerella on the Affirm. The only text book symptom I have is the thin, pasty, white, bubbly dishcarge. Any theories?

Morphia, you should get The V Book by Dr. Elizabeth Stewart.

There's a chapter on other types of vaginitis besides the big 3 (yeast, BV, Trich):

atrophic - estrogen-loss, treated with vaginal estrogen
strep - caused by antibiotics for BV, treated with amoxicillin
mobiluncus - caused by antibiotics for BV (esp. metrogel), treated with IV gentamicin
desquamative inflammatory vagintis (DIV) - unknown cause, treated with hydrocortisone

(Personally, my mind is blown at the notion that you can get vaginitis (strep, mobiluncus) from the antibiotics we take for BV - and the doctors don't tell us about this possibility! Do they even know? And we just get the same old pills over and over again. What the fuck!?!? Okay, rant over.)

There's also a good section on skin conditions that could cause irritation.

Amazon.com has it. (I got mine at Borders.)

http://www.amazon.com/Book-Doctors-Complet...8951&sr=8-1


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lori
post Jun 18 2007, 12:40 AM
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QUOTE(arj75 @ Jun 17 2007, 10:15 PM) *
Does anyone know where the research lab is located that are studying, and or producing lactobacillus-L and L jensenii? Our probotics don't have these included..and they are needed in our vaginal flora.

I don't think every strain of lactobacillus can be replicated in a lab like that. Activia yogurt contains "Bifidus Regularis" (ha ha, "regularis") and Dan-Active yogurt contains "L. casei Immunitas." These are lab-created and shown to have good effects, but they aren't naturally found in a healthy body.

This is why I'm so excited about Fem-dophilus.

QUOTE(arj75 @ Jun 17 2007, 10:15 PM) *
(Not really, at least not right now anyway..no yeast or bv.) (This is a record for me, first period in two years when it didn't come back.

Also, I have never taken flagyl, (as I am paranoid of antibotics anyway)....Does metro-gel not treat trich? Just curious..because other than the "C" word I have only used metro-gel.

Good for you for being BV-free (for now)! What do you think is helping you?

Also - metrogel does not treat Trich. You need to take the oral meds to kill it.

Here's a link: http://www.healthline.com/yodocontent/preg...homoniasis.html

Metronidazole is also available as an intravaginal gel, but this form is only recommended for treating bacterial vaginosis. Because trichomoniasis involves not only the vagina, but also nearby glands and the urethra, local treatments (intravaginal gel) often cannot achieve a complete cure.


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Morphia
post Jun 17 2007, 11:32 PM
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Who here has bv with no odor? I still think its odd that I have such a persistent and virulent case of bv and it doesn't smell. I don't want to jinx myself here but I have to say its strange. No smell, it burns, yet it keeps coming up as gardnerella on the Affirm. The only text book symptom I have is the thin, pasty, white, bubbly dishcarge. Any theories?
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arj75
post Jun 17 2007, 10:58 PM
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Hello everyone!

Does anyone know where the research lab is located that are studying, and or producing lactobacillus-L and L jensenii? Our probotics don't have these included..and they are needed in our vaginal flora.

Who is interested in putting on their cat women suits with me and sneaking into the place to steal them? lol.
They won't hold us in jail to long as if we were to get caught, we would stink them out of the place.

I don't think our doctors are understanding of how bad our stinch is, I wish we could box it up for them to take a real "wiff" test. For instance, the pain scale...rate it from 1-10...how bad is your pain? how about a stinch scale...rate from 1 to 100. (mine as a 100). (Not really, at least not right now anyway..no yeast or bv.) (This is a record for me, first period in two years when it didn't come back.

Also, I have never taken flagyl, (as I am paranoid of antibotics anyway)....Does metro-gel not treat trich? Just curious..because other than the "C" word I have only used metro-gel.

Morphia, how much digging have you done in regards to mycoplasma genitalium? I did some snooping into that tonight..interesting..very interesting. (inflammatory actions....found in male and female reproductive organs...linked to UTI's....heart problems...linked to Crohn's disease...asthma...(fungi parasite orgin?) (Similiar scientist debates as whether they are cause or effect of these diseases..

Not that I am bi-sexual, but why can they prove or not prove if females can pass this and forth to each other. If they can't prove that, how do they get off saying men and women can't pass it back in forth..(assuming it's only bv, and not something else)

I am SO GLAD ilovehim..isn't knocked up..and I hope she gets her skinny ass into the doctor VERY SOON!

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sassy
post Jun 17 2007, 05:34 PM
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Ilovehim: I had BV before, during, and after treatment of the gonnorhea. Nothing really changed, besides that the STD was cleared.
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lori
post Jun 17 2007, 03:02 PM
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QUOTE(for the birds @ Jun 17 2007, 05:29 AM) *
I've been reading up- doing some research- and I came across an interesting possibility. Has anyone ever heard of a bacterial infection called a Mycroplasma infection? I think it is worth looking into.

mycroplasma Infection Info

Look into it a little more and let me know what you guys think!

Hello for the birds. We've actually already covered mycoplasma/ureaplasma infections as one of the possibilities. Some members had bacterial cultures to look for this, and other possibilities. I also wrote about this on my blog to get the word out (rather hastily, however).

But the info. about PCR test is interesting, so thanks for sharing. This article is 10 years old, so some of the research is outdated (e.g., they no longer use Zithromax to treat it, because it's ineffective). But it's still one of those good things to have on our radars.

And ITA about the hormones. Not something to be messed with, for sure!

QUOTE(ilovehim @ Jun 16 2007, 08:27 PM) *
Thanks for your input: Lori, and BV Girl... =)

Um, just one more question, I'm kind of anxious to start the boric. Will I be able to start while on my menses or do you recomend me to wait until after it's over with?

You're welcome ilovehim. But the answer is neither. You said you had burning piss for a while, and your partner's penis smells bad. YOU NEED TO GO TO THE DOCTOR. No ifs ands or buts!

So make an appointment ASAP so you can go as soon as you stop bleeding. Until then, do not use boric acid or anything else.

If you don't have a regular doctor, go to Planned Parenthood. (Here's their website.)

AFTER your doctor's appointment - I agree with bvgirl. There was some confusion (in this thread) about the proper strength of boric acid (some people used the pure form, some used diluted), etc. So I would just get Yeast Arrest.


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jewelscando
post Jun 17 2007, 02:50 PM
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Ilovehim...very interesting information....thank you.. Makes sense now....
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ilovehim
post Jun 17 2007, 02:32 PM
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QUOTE(sassy @ Jun 17 2007, 10:17 AM) *
I had gonnorhea, but like I said, I had NO symptoms and neither did my fiancee.



Do you think you had the BV along with the gonnorhea, or got it afterwards? sad.gif


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ilovehim
post Jun 17 2007, 02:30 PM
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QUOTE(for the birds @ Jun 17 2007, 07:29 AM) *
I've been reading up- doing some research- and I came across an interesting possibility. Has anyone ever heard of a bacterial infection called a Mycroplasma infection? I think it is worth looking into.

mycroplasma Infection Info

Look into it a little more and let me know what you guys think!



Alright you just freaked me out with that one! That's very interesting. I never have heard of this infection before....


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sassy
post Jun 17 2007, 09:00 AM
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QUOTE(ilovehim @ Jun 16 2007, 10:14 PM) *
Well Girls-

I'm NOT pregnant! Thank Goodness for that because I plan on starting the BORIC ACID treatment after my period ends. Did any of you (who have used b/a) get any bad side effects? Did it kill the smell? That would be my goal; killing the nasty nasty odor.

& SASSY, not to be nosy or anything but what STD did you have? I'm concerned about STDs myself. Gonoreah and Clymidia to be exact (since my piss has been burning for a while.) This never happened to me before, it started up a couple months ago. & My man's penis has a foul odor most of the time. So i'm confused as to what I might have.



I had gonnorhea, but like I said, I had NO symptoms and neither did my fiancee.
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arj75
post Jun 17 2007, 07:08 AM
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QUOTE(for the birds @ Jun 17 2007, 06:51 AM) *
Hi, PLEASE, PLEASE, I can not stresss this enough, PLEASE be very careful in regards to growth hormone injections, or any growth hormone what so ever!

Here's why:

My brother-in-law was born without a functioning pituitary gland and was less than 4 feet tall most of his childhood. Standford University began a study on 100 of America's most growth challenged children, and had recruited my brother-in-law, Matt, to participate.

So, to cut it short- Out of 100 children participating in the study, 78 were given GROWTH HORMONE INJECTIONS and all 78 given hormones died of cancer before they turned 18. ALL OF THEM!

Just before Matt was to receive these shots, his Mom decided to hold off for two weeks in order to think it over and

BOOM!

Puberty hit and he began to grow so fast that his joints grew apart because they couldn't keep up with his bones!

So Lucky for him!
BE EXTREMELY CAREFUL WHEN MESSING WITH HORMONES! I'D LEAVE THEM ALONE!

THIS IS ALL 100% TRUE.



I have already came to the conclusion that nothing at this forum can be "off the topic" regarding to bv....discussing hormones, for some, is a pretty damn big issue.

I have thinking about the hormones & antibotics that animals are injected with (that we eat) (very interesting).
Also, as far as hormones..our liver forms the cholesterol for our sex hormones. Another possibilty, that should be considered, as liver dysfunction IS a possiblilty and should not be taken lightly.

Also, if your BV is in fact hormone related..did you all know that most doctors won't use hormone therapy if you smoke? (I didn't)
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for the birds
post Jun 17 2007, 06:12 AM
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I've been reading up- doing some research- and I came across an interesting possibility. Has anyone ever heard of a bacterial infection called a Mycroplasma infection? I think it is worth looking into.

mycroplasma Infection Info

Look into it a little more and let me know what you guys think!
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for the birds
post Jun 17 2007, 05:34 AM
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QUOTE(neverending @ Jun 16 2007, 07:35 PM) *
I know this is off topic but how do I get my hands on growth hormone injections?


Hi, PLEASE, PLEASE, I can not stresss this enough, PLEASE be very careful in regards to growth hormone injections, or any growth hormone what so ever!

Here's why:

My brother-in-law was born without a functioning pituitary gland and was less than 4 feet tall most of his childhood. Standford University began a study on 100 of America's most growth challenged children, and had recruited my brother-in-law, Matt, to participate.

So, to cut it short- Out of 100 children participating in the study, 78 were given GROWTH HORMONE INJECTIONS and all 78 given hormones died of cancer before they turned 18. ALL OF THEM!

Just before Matt was to receive these shots, his Mom decided to hold off for two weeks in order to think it over and

BOOM!

Puberty hit and he began to grow so fast that his joints grew apart because they couldn't keep up with his bones!

So Lucky for him!



BE EXTREMELY CAREFUL WHEN MESSING WITH HORMONES! I'D LEAVE THEM ALONE!

THIS IS ALL 100% TRUE.
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