[Allison-Shine]

I'm confused. Are you responding to RandyBrador's comments of Jan 6, 2009?

Link appears to be dead, it was before my time anyways.

[KeraBear]

I'm confused. Are you responding to RandyBrador's comments of Jan 6, 2009?

Let him have it anyways!

[auralpoison]

I'm confused. Are you responding to Randy Brador's comments of Jan 6, 2009?

[lightchested]

WHO KNOWS HOW/WHY, BUT I SAW A POST FROM RANDYSOMETHING AND THOUGHT IT WAS POSTED TODAY...

Oh well. I'll leave this to ward of future man-posters.

Randy-

When you assess yourself, do you do so through "collective womens' eyes", or through your own?

When you try to discern how you feel about something, do you measure it by how YOU feel, or how you assume a bunch of people you don't know feel?

Is there any body part on your that you don't like? If so, is it because YOU don't like it, or because you "think" that women in general don't like it?

We have brains of our own, and that's what we use to think with. We are allowed to have feelings that have nothing to do with men. Our breasts are a body part on us: if men think our breasts "belong to" or "are for" men, then that is unfortunate. We consider our breasts a part of ourselves, and belonging to us, and we are free to have feelings and thoughts about them that have nothing whatsoever to do with what we think some anonymous Collective of Men might feel about them.

If this seems rude, it's because you're not the first man in my life, or on this board, to assume that my (or any of our) feelings towards my (our) breasts has to do with men. If it were so simple as knowing that some men prefer small breasts, I think we'd all have been quite done with all of this a long time ago. It's not a news flash to us. But thanks for trying- you do seem to have meant well. Can you see how it's insulting, though? The insinuation that we didn't know that some men find small breasts attractive? Because it insinuates that it's such a rarity, that we've never actually come across it ourselves. Like we're so freakish that we are supposed to be shocked to hear from someone that "some men really DO like our breasts!" We are women, not thirteen year old girls.

And as it happens, I was a stripper, and though I don't know if I agree that the slight-of-chest "hands down" made more money than the Biggie Sized, I certainly never felt handicapped. I do think the girls who pushed the boundaries farther tended to make more money than the others. I wasn't that type myself: I'd rather make less money & leave with my dignity intact. I'm not judging the others...it's just how I am.

-Lightchested

[KeraBear]

Dudes,

I am in shock

click this but not on an empty or full stomach:
http://www.thefrisky.com/post/246-itty-bit...-support-group/

I feel like I am going to be sick.

Yeah, for sure! How do you think i feel, being practically the main subject and all? Sure, practically anybody in the world can read all that, but that doesn't really change that i posted that content with the intentions of people in the bust lounge community seeing and responding to it, you know?

Oh yeah, and could they have picked a better photo? I am all about the cool, confident small breasted gal. That girl looks genuinely SHOCKED that she has small breasts... like she woke up in the morning and they were gone all of a sudden. "OMG, what happened to my chest?!?""

[buttercups]

Hi ladies, I've been a little MIA lately spending a lot of time outside for the last few days of my vacation, but I just skimmed the boards and I have heard about BDD being linked to abuse, I guess I just never quite thought of it as the cause of my BDD. I always just assumed that it was because my breasts are so small that that was the root cause. Guess that may not be the case.. I'm gonna read up and comment more later.

[angie_21]

She looks lovely either way.

She does. As nice as it may be for us to hear that maybe people will stop being obsessed with big boobs for a few months while fashions change and slim figures come back into style, it's still an obsession with breasts. And it's never OK for people to feel they need to have surgery to fit into a dress, not matter what their size or shape. It's sad when something like that is written about as if it's some kind of feminist victory when people are still mutilating their bodies for fashion. (NOT saying that reduction surgery is mutliation, especially when done for comfort or health reasons like back pain and such, but when it's done for fashion or body image to fit some "beauty" stereotype, it's not much different than other types of plastic surgery)

[Aithinne]

What your mom and sis said has been bugging me. It's much more difficult to re-train negative self-talk when you're surrounded by people, especially family, who pass contemptuous judgments like that. So proud that you spoke up that way. It reminded me of this comment from a thread about a completely different topic, but the principle is similar (of communicating that certain comments hurt, and, building on that, that people who are considerate and not selfish or thoughtless will stop making them around you):

get them to stop and think about the consequences.You say to them, "Mom and Dad, when you say things like this, you hurt me." Give them a specific example.They will yesbut you in return. Let them finish.Then you say, "Now that you know this hurts me, if it happens again, we will both know you are doing it on purpose."This speech, plus meaningful eye contact on the next offense, cured a friend's parents of a twenty-year family "joke".

I was bothered by buttercups' family making negative comments as well. They certainly don't help her gain confidence. Family should be the people you turn to for support, not the people who tear you down. That was a very good strategy to tell the family members that what they say really hurts and is not acceptable. Either they don't realize they're stuck in a breast-obsessed thought pattern themselves, or they are doing out of a desire to hurt, which really is horrible.

[auralpoison]

It's kind of misleading the way that article used the pictures of Drew Barrymore, they are photos of her at obvious, drastically different weights. Also, she had a breast reduction when she was sixteen, she's never had implants. There is rumor that post her early thirties weight loss, she had another reduction & a lift to spiffy things up. She looks lovely either way.

[altricial]

There is hope for us yet! http://www.thefrisky.com/post/246-is-downs...00:49Z?eref=RSS

[angie_21]

I agree that it was a rude move, and from my training, the author made a bad choice in an ethical grey area. In an academic arena, she technically wouldn't be required to ask for our permission since we are posting publicly knowing that anyone could read what we write. But since she didn't even try to introduce herself to us, or ask what we actually think, she could have a pretty tough time passing an ethics review. I don't know about journalism though. If she's making money off the article or publishing a book, I don't know if she can directly quote us without our permission.

[lightchested]

I felt like the author should have gotten permission to do those copy/pastes. It's one thing to write an opinion on the existence of a support board (which I find rude in the first place, even though she relents in the article that this one isn't a pity party) but to quote people without their permission- even though our names are anonymous- bothers me. Those peoples' feelings were lifted & printed without their consent, and that bothers me. It felt like someone reading our diary and printing it for others' inspection. Sure, anyone could come to this link anyway, but she shoved it in the face of anyone who read the article, so they didn't even have to bother clicking on to here. I don't know. I have always been hyper-sensitive about respecting others' privacy, and it made me feel gross that people who are in no position to judge us or our feelings were basically put on the jury, by reading that article, to judge the validity of this support board. I admit I'm sensitive.

[angie_21]

Yeah lightchested, someone found that when it was originally posted online and it started a bit of a discussion over here. It's not too big a deal, since this is a publicly visible message board, but we were kinda miffed that the author never dropped in to introduce herself or even give us a heads up that she was publishing the article online, which is standard etiquette when it comes to these things.

Someone deleted all of Pip's messages, so I never got to read them! Bummer, I think it would have given me some entertainment for today. Oh well.

It was a different spin than the normal BDD therapist, who does the whole typical cognitive behavior thing. He says those things don't work well with BDD because they reinforce the negative thought patterns. (typical BDD therapy asks you to always give "proof" for your negative feelings, but this guy said that's NOT a good idea because that forces BDD people to then find proof- in their minds anyway- and convince themselves further of the negative thought)

Yikes, that sounds pretty bang-on. The whole problem with BDD, OCD, hypochondria, and all these conditions treated with cognitive behavioural therapy is that part of the problem is how good our brains are at coming up with excuses, proofs, symptoms, and signs that don't really exist. But I think that the good thing about CBT is that it forces you to recognize the negative messages you are telling yourself, and recognize that those things aren't true. The problem with CBT is that it seems to focus too strongly on awareness. I also add the more Buddhist concept of compassion & gratitude. Compassion to understand why other people can be so judgemental and hurtful, and gratitude that I am healthy, intellgent and capable, that I live in a wonderful country and have control and choices in my own life. It's not just being aware of the negative thoughts, it's having a wide range of positive thoughts to replace those negative thoughts with.

[kittenb]

I don't understand. Is there something in the article or comments that offended you or just the article itself?

[lightchested]

Dudes,

I am in shock

click this but not on an empty or full stomach:
http://www.thefrisky.com/post/246-itty-bit...-support-group/

I feel like I am going to be sick.

[blondenorwegian]

Just checked back here for the first time in a few months.

To be perfectly honest, I had never heard of BDD before this! And I agree with the previous posts, buttercup. Positive reaffirmations, as corny as they may sound at first, help combat the negative thoughts. If you have faced abuse in the past, take it from some women who know (including me) and consider therapy. But I'm really glad that you (and, well, everyone here) has been able to share their thoughts and support.

To add to the positive affirmations, I'll share 3 stories with you:

1) I recently saw many of my girlfriends at a friend's wedding this summer. I brought up the story of my boyfriend from my first post and how his comment about his ex's "phenomenal tits" caused me to tailspin and seriously consider things like surgery. All of these women are considerably more busty than me, and they looked at me with their jaws dropped to the floor. "Why?? Why would you ever want to have bigger boobs?" they said. Two of my friends (both C's) later told me that they ENVIED my figure, and wished they had my frame in high school. Here I had envied girls with bigger breasts, and they were jealous of ME. (By the way, the bride was small-chested and wore a satiny gown with no bra, no padding, no nothing. Everyone talked all night about how beautiful she looked.)

2) I found this issue of Glamour magazine- I avoid these magazines as a rule- but this headline caught my eye. It's an article that discusses breast health and the truth behind sizes and gadgets to make things bigger. But what caught my attention is that they listed (with photos) beautiful women in Hollywood with A-cups.

3) I asked a guy friend what he thought about the big breasts vs. small breasts debate. He said, "Honestly, there's no such thing as too small. I'd rather have a girl that can fit in my hand."

Hang in there!

[lightchested]

Just curious...Who helped you the most? I would tend to think the first option. It's funny how you can get such conflicting advice. As I think you said previously, you have to sometimes try different therapists. I hope you were able to find the help you needed, you seem very strong.

The guy who helped me the most was the one you indicated...the first one I wrote about.

If I seem strong, it's because I'm not amidst a BDD attack at the moment!!! But I know what you mean...in my un-triggered times, I do feel very strong! I just can't believe how quickly I can fall apart at the sight of some random female or a comment on TV or even a should-be-forgotten memory!!! I don't know how to hold on to the strong in those times. Or even find it at all.

[anarch]

there was a girl whose breasts were at least as teeny as mine and she was wearing this gorgeous bandeau halter bikini- and she looked goooood! We were all sitting on the beach and I commented that I liked her bathing suit. My mom and sister were like "no, it only draws attention to the fact that shes flat" and with everyone and my bf right there I said , " well i think she looks hot and having small breasts is NOT a flaw!"- everyone shut up then : )

What your mom and sis said has been bugging me. It's much more difficult to re-train negative self-talk when you're surrounded by people, especially family, who pass contemptuous judgments like that. So proud that you spoke up that way. It reminded me of this comment from a thread about a completely different topic, but the principle is similar (of communicating that certain comments hurt, and, building on that, that people who are considerate and not selfish or thoughtless will stop making them around you):

get them to stop and think about the consequences.You say to them, "Mom and Dad, when you say things like this, you hurt me." Give them a specific example.They will yesbut you in return. Let them finish.Then you say, "Now that you know this hurts me, if it happens again, we will both know you are doing it on purpose."This speech, plus meaningful eye contact on the next offense, cured a friend's parents of a twenty-year family "joke".

More on making your boundaries clear and enforcing them with people close to you. I love this part: "Other people ignoring our boundaries is NOT what causes us to get angry. We get angry when we do not gracefully and compassionately honor our own boundaries (whether with or without the other person’s cooperation).
- This is because our boundaries can only be as clear and as strong as our support for our own wants, limits, choices, and values."

Nthing how cool all the wisdom here on self-esteem and self-respect is. You're all lovely.

[Persephone3]

I agree with so much of the wonderful advice that has been given here. But sexual abuse is very serious and could be the root cause of a lot of your problems. Surpressed emotions may manifest themself in the critical nature of your own body. You may want to consult a therapist, because you deserve to be happy and feel good about yourself. You would be surprised that when you start to deal with your issues, how it can change your whole perspective. But I believe all of this has already been said.


Not that this needed reiterating, since it's spot on, but I just wanted to add that the best BDD therapist I went to said most people with BDD have one or more of the following in their past:

1) sexual abuse
2) emotional abuse
3) "bullying" victimization in school

I was #3 big time. And my parents weren't exactly the lovey types. This particular therapist says that what needs to happen is that you play out your significant traumatic events in which you did not get the support you needed, to make you feel that YOU WERE OKAY and it was the other person that had the problem, and play it out with a therapist, who plays the role of an older sister or brother, or parent, or teacher, or SOMEONE who should have stepped in. He says it's to overwrite in your mind the most significant painful memories, so that you realize YOU ARE OKAY. That's what he told me anyway. It wasn't all he did, but it was part of his program.

It was a different spin than the normal BDD therapist, who does the whole typical cognitive behavior thing. He says those things don't work well with BDD because they reinforce the negative thought patterns. (typical BDD therapy asks you to always give "proof" for your negative feelings, but this guy said that's NOT a good idea because that forces BDD people to then find proof- in their minds anyway- and convince themselves further of the negative thought)

And then there are the drug pushers...
(anti-depressants)
yuk

Just curious...Who helped you the most? I would tend to think the first option. It's funny how you can get such conflicting advice. As I think you said previously, you have to sometimes try different therapists. I hope you were able to find the help you needed, you seem very strong.

[lightchested]

I agree with so much of the wonderful advice that has been given here. But sexual abuse is very serious and could be the root cause of a lot of your problems. Surpressed emotions may manifest themself in the critical nature of your own body. You may want to consult a therapist, because you deserve to be happy and feel good about yourself. You would be surprised that when you start to deal with your issues, how it can change your whole perspective. But I believe all of this has already been said.


Not that this needed reiterating, since it's spot on, but I just wanted to add that the best BDD therapist I went to said most people with BDD have one or more of the following in their past:

1) sexual abuse
2) emotional abuse
3) "bullying" victimization in school

I was #3 big time. And my parents weren't exactly the lovey types. This particular therapist says that what needs to happen is that you play out your significant traumatic events in which you did not get the support you needed, to make you feel that YOU WERE OKAY and it was the other person that had the problem, and play it out with a therapist, who plays the role of an older sister or brother, or parent, or teacher, or SOMEONE who should have stepped in. He says it's to overwrite in your mind the most significant painful memories, so that you realize YOU ARE OKAY. That's what he told me anyway. It wasn't all he did, but it was part of his program.

It was a different spin than the normal BDD therapist, who does the whole typical cognitive behavior thing. He says those things don't work well with BDD because they reinforce the negative thought patterns. (typical BDD therapy asks you to always give "proof" for your negative feelings, but this guy said that's NOT a good idea because that forces BDD people to then find proof- in their minds anyway- and convince themselves further of the negative thought)

And then there are the drug pushers...
(anti-depressants)
yuk