[katiebelle2882]

HAHAHAHA she DID?! why is this only coming out now? that is fantastic. in a really weird way.

[missladyj]

I work in a high school and 14, 15 even 16 year old boys are to put it bluntly GROSS they are pimply, scrawny, smelly and super immature. Why any woman would want to fuck one of them is beyond me. While it takes two to tango the teacher is the adult in a situation of power and it is exploitative to fuck this kids, becuase well, they are still kids. but mainly boys at that age are truly gross. when it comes to sex, yes 15 year old boys are totally clueless which makes them easier to manipulate.

[maddy29]

how random and weird....

[girlygirlgag]

Here is a gross little tid bit: Debra LaFave took Nick Carter's Virginity. They dated in High School.

[maddy29]

sure, 15 is different than a five year old, but it's still a major abuse of power. i don't know many 15 year olds who have a clue....do you?

sorry, 14.....

[capilot]

Sure, she's nasty for trying to bed a 15 year old, BUT it takes two to tango.

According to Wikipedia, he was 14 and she was 25. I assume you'd be saying the same thing about a 14-year-old girl and a 25-year-old man?

[dani837]

Debra Lafave's ex husband was on Dr Phil today, they were making a show about (male) students having sex with their (female) teachers.
The only thing I'm going to say about this is that they try to put it like its all the woman's fault. Sure, she's nasty for trying to bed a 15 year old, BUT it takes two to tango. The guys were around 15 year olds, don't come and tell me they are sweet and innocent and they didn't know what they were doing! Please.

[katiebelle2882]

i am not sure now how i feel about the boys now. i do think some boys would think its cool, but that doesnt mean its good for them i understand that and agree with you guys. i also think bc of socialization, boys would be more likely to think its cool then girls do, but again, not necessarily good for them.


i am not only speaking from my experience, but from others as well, wombat is just yet another one. i am not the ONLY 16 year old who has ever slept with a 20 year old (or any other age combo within reason) i am not going to sit here and name peoples names. and, until you are in that position, GGG, dont think that no 16 year olds have stuff in common with 20 year olds, and i tried to state when maddy asked me to explain how it was. if anything thats just being as guilty of using personal experience only as you say i am.

again i will say that really, there isnt a huge difference btw 16 and 18 (especially since 16 is the age of consent in some states!) and if people are ready, they are ready. if not, well then definitly dont do it just because others are.

[wombat]

Right! Like some of us have green fur all over our bodies and some of us.. oh, wait


I kinda support Katiebelle in that I always have slept with older men. Including my first one. Always had crushes on older boys, too. There may even be a biological difference about that in the sense that boys mature later. But, my crushes were for guys 2 or three years older -- not, say, my friend's dads. You can KIND OF feel that way, but it's different, and if acted upon, especially with the social consequences if discovered - well, it would not be good.

The biggest age difference for me was when I was 18 and slept with a guy who was 31 -- this was because the boys in my college were dorky, and not in that "cute" way. He was hot, but very selfish and distant and probably slept with younger people for an ego thing or because he didn't want to move on. I can't say he should be criminally liable or anything, but, he still wasn't an optimum kind of person. It's just generally true that the bigger the age difference the more likely that one or both partners has some kind of uncomfortable issues and is looking for a subsitute of some kind.

It's good to recognize that teacher/student or other power differential can be hot if people are playing roles but would usually have bad consequences if acted upon in real life...

two cents

[maddy29]

ggg- this is exactly what i was upset with, and yeah, katie never did get back to discussing that (at least i dont' think so...).


"Plus with your attitude, it could be seen as emasculating oneself if a boy were to say they were raped by their "Hot older teacher""

it's important for us to all be listened to and for our experience to be heard, but we also have to remind ourselves that we're just one person with one experience.

i swear, this board is helping me so much, really realizing how different people are. just SO different, even if you have tons and tons of things in common, no matter what, there will be things that you disagree on. that sounds sorta dumb, but lately it's just been hitting me a lot-that there are some things i'll never get (like ear piercing/ tattoos/ high heels / wanting to be a mom/ working in the sex industry,etc etc...). (those are just random examples off the top of my head). and even though i don't get it, or understand, or even "approve" (in some places), i have to just accept it! and that's really damn hard to do, at least for me. it's not that my opinion is wrong, or the other person's is, it's just we are different.

la la la, i sound like fucking sesame street or something. ack

[girlygirlgag]

katie, your whole argument has been based on sweeping generalizations of your own experience on others'.

I understand an 18 year old and a 20 year old, but not a 16 year old and a 20 yr old, what does a 16 year old and a 20 year old have in common?

You started your point by saying all boys who could have sex with their "hot" older, teacher would think it was rad. I think that is a blanket generalization and it is sexist.

Which you never address, nor back up with anything but your experience as a girl. Look at Mary Kay's now husband, that kid is pretty screwed up. Can't hold a job, is on medication for depression, do you think it may have to do with being manipulated by an older woman in a position of power, when his mother was unavailable, and now he is too far deep to realize? Plus with your attitude, it could be seen as emasculating oneself if a boy were to say they were raped by their "Hot older teacher".

[katiebelle2882]

if you read my next post GGG, you would know that i HAVE had one.

also, i wasnt taking issue with the fact about the person in higher position thing, bc i agree with people on that, and have never had that type of experience. i was taking issue with your "its always inappropriate for a 16 year old to be with a 20 year old and i dont care if i am condecending". considering that was a direct response to what i had said, i am not exactly sure there is any other way to take it but personally.

i also take issue with the fact that (and this has nothing to do with a personal thing) their are sweeping generalizatinons being said about people of a certain age group and their ability to reason, which is something i just dont think you can necessarily do. i am personally comfortable with my decisions, which is why i dont like to see women who are suppposedly sex positive knocking down other women when it comes to sexuality. its one thing to protect children against abusers (and we must) but its another thing to assume that a 17 year old cant make an informed decision to sleep with someone older (NOT a teacher) and then say you dont care if you are condesending. you have to protect people, but it cant be done in a condescending way, or without realizing that they are all different when it comes to maturity etc.

[maddy29]

thanks katie-i hear what you're saying. that's more like how my sister was, just pretty matter of fact about it and grounded and not scared, etc. she just enjoyed sex and didnt' really have any "issues" around it.

[girlygirlgag]

Katie, I think you are taking everything as a personal attack and basing a law and policy decision on YOUR personal experiences.

This is not only a decision about morals but ethics as well.

It is never appropriate for an individual of a higher position to carry on an affair with someone of a lower position, whether teacher-student, boss-employee, etc. etc.

But I do believe it is morally wrong when that dicotomy includes an adult and a child.

Also, for anyone to be flippant about abortions at any age has never had to experience it, is in EXTREMELY bad taste and I would ask for people to be more sensitive when bringing up that topic.

[katiebelle2882]

the 20 year old ended up being my boyfriend for a little over a year when i was 18. i met him out where my grandmothers beach house is, where its just kind of a total free for all. in a good way. i mean i am still good friends with him, almost best friends with his sister, and the girl hes with now is a good friend of mine as well. i mean we hooked up for about a year then dated after a mutual friend of ours (who was actually my best friend) died in a car accident. we just kinda fell into a relationship and it was fine. its hard to explain really because of how the dynamic is at this place i am talking about, but it really didnt seem like iw as 16, and he was 20, if you know what i mean.

to tell you the truth, growing up catholic, i sort of expected it to be this big life changing thing that i was going to feel guilty about, when, i couldnt have had a better experience. i also didnt think it was like this huge deal, it was like, whatever. and i dont mean whatever in the way that i didnt enjoy it, cause i certainly did, but just like, is this why everyone makes such a fuss? what everyone gets so crazy about. what everyone feels guilty about? why are people scarred by it? (unless its rape or abusive obviously!) i just didnt understand why people wait and all this other stuff. i think i was mature, and ready for it really. i am also not the type to get attached at all. it was with a BF who i loved and who loved me, but by no stretch of the imagination do i need to be interested in the person romantically to have sex with them, and i certainly dont expect to date them, nor do i want to. in fact, its half the reason i get so bored in relationships. the sex turns miserably boring and i get a wandering eye.

and you know, getting laid by 19 year old frat boys isnt always a bad thing;) esp if they are yummy football players.

but yeah, i wouldnt say for your first time it would be fun lol.

anyway i am way off topic, but i hope you sorta understood the story i tried to tell in the beginning!

[maddy29]

katie-yeah, i don't think you having sex with your boyfriend at age 15 is a big deal. at all. you were obviously ready and willing and fine with it and it didn't scar you or anything. would you be willing to share what the situation was with the 20 y.o.? like how you met him, etc?

i guess i think teens can have sex with each other but i hope they are educated about safe sex, the consequences, and are ready emotionally, etc, etc-something that doesn't really happen much-i think it's mostly just horny kids having fun. better sex ed and all that stuff would make me feel much better about kids having sex.

sidecar- yeah, i didn't have sex til i was older, as well. glad i never gave into pressure, cause sex with 19 year old frat boys is really not good...heh. i finally just wanted to do it and see what the big deal was when i was 18, but it was so bad that i wasnt' interested in it again for a looong time.

[pepper]

mmm, didja see the teeny whale tale on House tonight? yeah, because that girl was a grown up...

[mornington]

the way I understand it, in the uk, although the age of consent is 16, but you aren't legally an adult until you turn 18 (although there are all sorts of grey areas when it comes to crimes). I'm not entirely sure what leeway there is with say a 16yo having sex with a 15yo, but I think it doesn't count as statuatory rape.



I think there is a grey area in the later teenage years - 15 onwards - because everyone develops at different rates. However I do think that 16 is a good age for the age of consent (not that it seems to matter much anyway to teenagers).

[katiebelle2882]

oh i know it isnt readily available, but its something you need to be prepared to think about if you think you are ready to have sex. NY really is a shining example of abortion rights, and most counties in the US dont even have a provider.

my point is, what is an "adult'. adult is NOT 18 in many places when it comes to the age of consent.

[sidecar]

Abortion isn't nearly as readily available to teens as you seem to think it is, katie. I really don't mean to just jump on you--but there are a lot of states where those under 18 cannot get an abortion without notifying their parents or a judge, and in a number of those states, it's illegal to take a minor across state lines for an abortion. Also, in a number of states, Medicare won't cover it. I grew up in Wisconsin, parents of a minor must be notified--the judge isn't an option. And there are only five abortion clinics in the entire state, all in the southeastern part of the state--a pretty long way away for someone who gets knocked up 300 miles north.

I have to say, I think I'm a rarity in these parts. I waited until I was 19, and I've only slept with two people, one of whom I married. At the time, I was dying to get rid of my virginity and now, with nine years of hindsight, I'm glad I waited. To be honest, I kinda wish I'd waited longer, because even as late as it was, it wasn't the right time or the right person, and it made me think sex wasn't something positive for a long time. Being able to look back now, I know I wasn't ready for it, at least not with the person I was with at the time, and it was a part of why we broke up.

That being said, I just don't think an adult has any business being in a relationship with a kid. Sure there are anecdotal exceptions, but the laws can't be written for the exceptions.