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> small breast support group - (I need it even if they don't)
strongirl
post Jan 21 2011, 11:58 AM
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Insideout, people better not yell at you and I don't think they will. Nor should anyone yell at or disparage Spot-on for her choice. In the aftermath of the Arizona shooting and political reaction, I've given a lot of thought to how to promote civil discourse and respectful disagreement. If the rest of the world could pull that off like we do in here, it would be a wonderful thing. One of the things I love about our dialogue is that it lets me try on different perspectives in my own head, shift things around, work it out, acknowledge my own inner conflicts...instead of picking a "side" and sticking to it in a dogmatic, stubborn, self-righteous way. I think it is really wonderful that we can use this space to do that - to be honest, caring, and respectful even as we share different perspectives. Much appreciation to all who post here!

I think Spot-on was really brave to risk rejection and criticism by sharing her choice with us so openly and I think it's extremely generous of her to invite questions and give honest answers to help those of us who have considered implants or even just wondered what it's like. I've also found it heartwarming to see those of us who oppose implants continue to be kind and supportive of her. And I think it is totally legit to continue to voice opposition to implants as a cultural phenomenon and to reject it as a personal choice for ourselves, even while we continue to respect that it IS a choice.

I agree with Nbdx and Insideout about implants and skin lightening correcting perceived deficiencies that don't really exist and I feel sad to see those as a widespread cultural phenomenon, too. At the same time, I respect people's personal choice to modify their bodies in any way they choose that makes them feel better and enjoy their physical being more - whether it's tats, haircolor, or implants. And knowing that Spot-on got what she wanted without medical problems makes me feel happy.

So I feel sad about the cultural phenomenon of implants and happy about her individual outcome with implants at the same time. It's a bit twisted but I'm comfortable here.



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insideout
post Jan 21 2011, 10:14 AM
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I have to agree with nbdx again. In Tibet, nomad women have dark skin, and Tibetans in general have darker skin than the Chinese. Throughout Asia light skin is considered more beautiful and more desireable than dark skin, and because of this, Tibetan women especially want to have lighter skin - it not only looks more Chinese, it also looks more Western. So they buy skin whitening products which are, needless to say, not healthy or safe to use. I don't believe for one second that any of these women are doing this for themselves. They're doing it because of societal pressures. Does it matter that they think themselves more beautiful with lighter skin? I hope not. I hope what matters more is this: that a culture where the dark skin and red cheeks of a nomad used to be a source of pride is now being undermined because of naturally unattainable beauty standards.

So how is skin whitening any different from breast implants? In light of that question, I can't just shrug my shoulders and submit that such practices are done by women for women, as if they are some empowering procedure. What is happening to Tibetan women, although done of their own free will, is not empowering. It is sad.

That, I suppose, is just my opinion, and if anyone has a problem with it they can take it up with me. The rest of what I've said is fact, and I think they're facts worth considering when we draw our conclusions about augmentation and other procedures. I talk about Tibet because it is a place I've become intimately familiar with, but even closer to home issues of skin color and beauty standards exist. What if whitening became popular in the U.S. or Europe? Would body modification according to a beauty standard still be so acceptable, and even worse, expected? I should hope not. And I also wish that it didn't take the touchy subject of race to bring to light the backward nature of such societal practices.

If I've caused too much of a stir, feel free to yell at me smile.gif
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karategrrl
post Jan 21 2011, 09:41 AM
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QUOTE(nbdx0645 @ Jan 21 2011, 01:15 AM) *
Forgive me for my thoughts, but I do feel like implants are a means to correct a perceived deficiency that doesn't really exist.

Nothing personal either, but I agree. Sometimes I look in the mirror and feel "deficient," then I wonder if I would feel that way if every woman in the world has breasts my size. Or if mine were bigger than everyone else's, would I feel mine were "too big" and consider reduction? It's really all so relative. I think the issue is not that anyone's too big or small or too whatever, but our own difficulties with acceptance of ourselves. Small breasts are normal. It's our mindset about them that's not.

And I'll be the first to admit my hypocrisy, for sometimes I just wish I were a little bigger in the bust. Then again, if I could, I'd have non-grey hair, smaller hands and feet, longer legs, no cellulite on my butt, darker skin, etc. So either I'm going to make myself nuts over everything I'm "not" or look at everything going on with me that's beautiful and lovely and love myself the way I am. Once I get in that mode I really do think I look pretty darn great. smile.gif I think a lot of the problem is that we jsut get bored looking at ourselves and become blind to our own beauty.

And spot-on, nothing personal at all, really. While I don't feel implants are for me and I have some definite viewpoints on the topic, each has their own path to take. I'm just glad you are, healthwise, okay. And you didn't go overbaord with the size.

Thanks you for the link to that article. The cutesy tone in which it was written got annoying but the content was quite interesting, as was the commenter who said she's lso had hers removed and wishes she'd never messed with 'em.
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nbdx0645
post Jan 20 2011, 08:15 PM
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QUOTE(spot-on @ Jan 20 2011, 04:42 PM) *
a 34C is a 32B so she actually got what she wished for.


When the band size goes down (in this case from 34 to 32,) the cup size goes up, so it's actually a 32D.

Forgive me for my thoughts, but I do feel like implants are a means to correct a perceived deficiency that doesn't really exist. Small breasts on any type of body are completely normal and healthy, they're able to produce milk and receive pleasure. So where's the disconnect? I agree with the previously quoted comment to an extent, because I don't believe that we should be such high monitors of our physical appearance and we shouldn't place such a high value on "looking better" for others, and even for ourselves. I think about how much time I spend staring at my breasts, and then I think about how much time I gaze at my coworkers, family and friends. I don't know if I could really say that an enhancement would only be for myself. I forget what my breasts look like in my day-to-day life. I forget what my entire body looks like most of the time. Do I think that implants are a self-fulfilling prophecy? You betcha. Once you convince yourself, the universe falls into place. But what I'm saying is one opinion and I'm hoping that it isn't taken personally.
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strongirl
post Jan 20 2011, 08:10 PM
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Yeah, while we're on the smallie celeb thing, I came across something about Rachel McAdams today and didn't know who she was, so I googled her. Very attractive small-breasted hottie! I googled images and enjoyed several pics of her rocking that really low cut look.

And Natalie Portman sure is getting a lot of attention these days. I've always thought she was so gorgeous in such a classy way.
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spot-on
post Jan 20 2011, 05:45 PM
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Milla rocks! And Olivia Wilde (new Tron movie not seen it but she was hot in House). I think we've discussed it before but CONFIDENCE in your body is the key! Doesn't matter if you are stick thin, balloons for boobs, small boobs, or obese etc, if you have confidence then you are sexy as hell!!!

That's the thing with women like Milla, Olivia etc. They have confidence in buckets!

QUOTE(karategrrl @ Jan 17 2011, 05:07 AM) *
YEP!! that's why I looooove Milla Jovovich movies. She's hot as hell (just saw clips of one of the Resident Evil movies where she's wearing this little white tank top with nip erections...aww yeah!). But anyway, no one ever says in her movies, "Yeah, <character's name> is hot, even with her small breasts." She's just HOT. Period.

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spot-on
post Jan 20 2011, 05:42 PM
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Great article Strongirl, I read that last year before my surgery. However there are a few points in it that I want to comment on

QUOTE
“Two hundred cc for both left and right,” he said. Although it takes about 200 cc to increase your bra size by one cup (and 440 cc equals approximately one pound), my 200 cc must have consisted of Wonder Molecules, as my new bra measurements doubled from a 32A to a 34C—a full C"


a 34C is a 32B so she actually got what she wished for. Not sure if she put on some weight that made her band size go up, but there is no reason her ribcage measurement should change once initial swelling goes down. And the rule of 200cc to increase 1 cup size isn't true. It totally depends on the persons body size. 200cc is going to go much further on a smaller framed girl, than a larger girl with a wider ridcage!

The risk of rupture is the main reason I went with silicone. Silicone ruptures are fairly common, and one reason they now overfill them which makes them firmer.

Also about the comments.

QUOTE
For the women who do have it done, it must be great to get the attention of guys. But then again do you really want the attention of a guy who rarely makes eye contact? Wouldn't you want to be approached by the guy who prefers you unenhanced?


Honestly I haven't had any more/less attention from guys than I did before, but then that wasn't my objective and no do I dress in a revealing way. I also don't want to be approached by any guys, that's not why I did this AND I'm happily married! Why do people automatically assume women alter their bodies in ANY way to please or attract men? No sorry I did the surgery for ME! It HAS improved my self esteem and confidence a lot and so far I am very happy with the results.

When I previously heard women say "I did this for myself" I admit I thought that they really did it for male attention and I do think that some women do, BUT the great MAJORITY of women do this surgery to make themselves feel better, not to "hook a man". There are many references about men loving small/large/real/fake tits and honestly it shouldn't matter and who gives a flying fuck what they prefer?! If a guy is interested in YOU then only YOU matter regardless of the size of your boobs!!! If you want to shave your head, tattoo your face, get implants, piercings etc the guy should still love you, because you are the same person. They should be attracted to who you are not what you look like


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strongirl
post Jan 20 2011, 10:13 AM
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Came across a pretty well-written article about one woman's experiences with her breast implants. I think she does a good job of explaining her thought processes around all of it. I had mixed feelings about the ending but one of the commenters flipped it around in an interesting way, so read the comments.

This line from the article struck me as being kind of a combination of perspectives from some of us who post in here:

"In spite of my discovery that a sizable male population was rapturously devoted to ­daintily bosomed females, I perceived the stacked as possessing a primeval power, an elusive feminine mystique."

http://www.elle.com/Beauty/Health-Fitness/...Breast-Implants
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karategrrl
post Jan 17 2011, 08:07 AM
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QUOTE(insideout @ Jan 17 2011, 04:54 AM) *
Big magazines like that just pander to different groups of their readership by publishing an article here or there to make them happy, but their bottom line is money so they'll never be sending a clear message. It's just business, but I find it insulting how gullible they think we are. I actually wish that small breasts would stop being pointed out in the media whether for good or bad - even "good" or "nice" articles are really just pandering to the rule that bigger is better.

YEP!! that's why I looooove Milla Jovovich movies. She's hot as hell (just saw clips of one of the Resident Evil movies where she's wearing this little white tank top with nip erections...aww yeah!). But anyway, no one ever says in her movies, "Yeah, <character's name> is hot, even with her small breasts." She's just HOT. Period.

QUOTE(insideout @ Jan 17 2011, 04:54 AM) *
I felt better about my own mental health being able to say that out loud with so many people around - never done that before!

Good for you!!
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insideout
post Jan 16 2011, 11:54 PM
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nbdx I agree with you. Big magazines like that just pander to different groups of their readership by publishing an article here or there to make them happy, but their bottom line is money so they'll never be sending a clear message. It's just business, but I find it insulting how gullible they think we are. I actually wish that small breasts would stop being pointed out in the media whether for good or bad - even "good" or "nice" articles are really just pandering to the rule that bigger is better. If you ask me, we shouldn't even be acknowledging this rule, so what is there to write about? If a guy were to say to me "your breasts are small," (or an insult, etc.) I wouldn't reply with "uh, well, they don't cause back pain and they will look more youthful in 20 years . . ." no! I'd say fuck you! My philosophy: there is no case to be made to anyone but ourselves in our own heads and forums.
And something positive: another story. There's a girl who works in the building where I live and she's insulted me about different things over the past few months. I've usually let it slide because people have suggested it's a culture thing :/ Anyways, a friend of mine related a conversation he had with her. It went something like this:
Girl: Do you like insideout?
Boy: No.
G: Is it because she has small breasts?
B: It's because we're good friends . . .
So he tells me about this and I'm livid. Then the other night we're walking back from dinner and I make a comment about how she and I are the same height, but I was speaking a different language so I guess I accidentally said we have the same body (because height is literally just "body length" in this language, and I left out the length part). And then she said "yeah we both have small breasts" in a sad voice. So I said "I love my small breasts!" The look on her face said she was really surprised yet glad to hear such blasphemy (note sarcasm). Anyway it's a positive because I found out why she said such a thing to my friend (her own insecurities, isn't that always the culprit), I made her feel better about her body, and I felt better about my own mental health being able to say that out loud with so many people around - never done that before!
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nbdx0645
post Jan 16 2011, 07:28 PM
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I picked up the latest Cosmopolitan at Boarders and thumbed through it. There's a small write-up about A-cups and how more women want less padding. It pointed out the obvious "no back pain" "looks younger" "less likely to get headaches" and it did talk about the sensitivity. A sexologist claimed that stimulation was more intense because there's less fat tissue covering up the nerve endings. If anybody has the Cosmo with Mila Kunis on the cover, could you provide a quote? I didn't buy the magazine...I usually pick it up to read the women's issues articles. I saw the article and was taken aback; then I skimmed the remainder of the magazine to see many images of women with big breasts for their frames. Some consistency from article-to-article would make the article's message stronger. Maybe I'm being overly critical since I'm a graphic designer for large publications.
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KeraBear
post Jan 15 2011, 10:45 AM
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QUOTE(strongirl @ Jan 11 2011, 11:30 AM) *
I almost wonder if this is a factor of size itself - with a finite number of nerve endings, would they be more sensitive if they are all bunched up together in a small area rather than spread out over large area? I dunno.


I have wondered this myself. If there is a study being conducted, I would be willing to participate!
tongue.gif

By the way, have you noticed my post count has dropped lately? School has started again.

dry.gif

Boooooo
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karategrrl
post Jan 14 2011, 02:56 PM
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QUOTE(strongirl @ Jan 14 2011, 05:18 PM) *
Wow, karategrrl, that sure was a bizarre little experience checking out those photos! Tres creepy, in my opinion! I think it is thoughtfully done and artful - I appreciate the work, both photographic and surgical. But whew. Disturbing and chilly. It is one thing to try to enhance nature but these photos look like people who are almost completely disassociating from it.


I hear ya. Ironically, I think most of these folks ended up looking similar to one another--like some creepy new race. Of course, not everyone who's had surgery looks like this. I think these were carefully chosen.
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strongirl
post Jan 14 2011, 12:18 PM
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Wow, karategrrl, that sure was a bizarre little experience checking out those photos! Tres creepy, in my opinion! I think it is thoughtfully done and artful - I appreciate the work, both photographic and surgical. But whew. Disturbing and chilly. It is one thing to try to enhance nature but these photos look like people who are almost completely disassociating from it.
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spot-on
post Jan 13 2011, 05:49 PM
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I'd heard stories of women losing sensation in the nipples etc, but mine... um hell yeah I have feeling there! I can only speak for myself obviously but my nips are WAY more sensitive now post surgery

Again just my experience!


And yes I hope we get more action soon too! Though most nights I am finishing work at 8pm ,dinner, walk dogs, then falling asleep! Crazy time of year for my industry but I love it smile.gif

QUOTE(strongirl @ Jan 11 2011, 08:30 AM) *
Hey Spot-on, thanks for the reply! Keep those updates coming. (and I hope you guys have more time to "get busy" soon!)

insideout, re. the sensitivity thing: HELL YES! We've talked about this in here before but I'm not sure if you were around then. A number of us smallies reported that we can actually climax on nip stim alone. It happens to me every now and again and I still find it amazing. It's one of the reasons my bf is so strongly opposed to implants - sometimes they reduce sensitivity and he says there's no way size could compare to the turn-on he gets from my responsiveness.

I almost wonder if this is a factor of size itself - with a finite number of nerve endings, would they be more sensitive if they are all bunched up together in a small area rather than spread out over large area? I dunno.

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karategrrl
post Jan 13 2011, 01:25 PM
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Since we've discussed plastic surgery and body image a lot here, I thought I'd post this--link to images from a new book by the photogprhaer Toledano. Click the right-hand buttons to see the pics.
Ick.
http://www.mrtoledano.com/A-new-kind-of-be...-kind-of-beauty
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strongirl
post Jan 11 2011, 11:30 AM
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Hey Spot-on, thanks for the reply! Keep those updates coming. (and I hope you guys have more time to "get busy" soon!)

insideout, re. the sensitivity thing: HELL YES! We've talked about this in here before but I'm not sure if you were around then. A number of us smallies reported that we can actually climax on nip stim alone. It happens to me every now and again and I still find it amazing. It's one of the reasons my bf is so strongly opposed to implants - sometimes they reduce sensitivity and he says there's no way size could compare to the turn-on he gets from my responsiveness.

I almost wonder if this is a factor of size itself - with a finite number of nerve endings, would they be more sensitive if they are all bunched up together in a small area rather than spread out over large area? I dunno.

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insideout
post Jan 10 2011, 08:21 AM
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Anyone else here an astrology nut? I don't take it for fact, but it is one of my favorite "slacker" activities. I'd recommend the book Sextrology, it's very fun to read and takes a very comprehensive approach to addressing sun signs and their sex lives. Anyways, I'm a cancer, and according to this book most cancers suffer from "breast envy" whether they're large or small because the sign rules the breasts and ovaries. This is sort of true for me, but upon closer examination of my own thoughts I've found that I don't envy other breasts, just what it means to have them. I realize that's sort of a roundabout statement; what I mean is this: I don't want my friend's large breasts. Most of the time I don't want larger breasts myself. What I want is to be sexy. It's been said on here before, but I want my small breasts to be sexy to other people just the way they are.

So I suppose if I were to write to the authors of Sextrology, I'd say that what I have is more of a fixation on breasts, not necessarily "breast envy."

I think I will make it a habit to end on a positive note: boys love how sensitive my nipples are, and I'm sure the look on a guy's face when he's met with a pair of knockers would pale in comparison to the look on a guy's face when I respond to his touch biggrin.gif I always tell myself, gratitude is the sexiest thing ever, and that's the gift that keeps on giving (but yelling "thank you" over and over again while having an orgasm, although perhaps a genuine sentiment, will make for amusing afterdinner entertainment for the neighbors . . .)
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spot-on
post Jan 8 2011, 02:46 PM
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Hi Strongirl
Nope sex life was not a big motivator for me, sure it was part of it but not a huge part.

When I initially broached the subject of surgery to my husband he said straight out that he didn't care how small/large my boobs were, and if I was doing it for him not to bother. He wasn't/isn't a boob man always been an ass man. He quizzed me making sure I was doing this for ME and not our sex life or for him. He loved my boobs before and he loves them now. He loves them because they are part of me.That said he does look at my boobs more, and fondles them more, but usually that's because I'm asking him how soft they feel compared to week 1, and he is obviously my photographer for my progress pics wink.gif He was also the 'judge' of clothing when I was deciding what looked good now. So his input is important, his opinion hasn't changed. He loved me regardless.

So far our sex life is pretty much the same, BUT we haven't had much chance to get busy with it wink.gif For 3 weeks I couldn't elevate my heart rate (which is honestly no fun for sex), and this week I've been back at work teaching classes and clients (after a 3 1/2 week break) which has pretty much seen me asleep on the sofa every night at around 10.30, and if I am honest a napped a couple of afternoons too. Once I get back into the swing of things, that may improve wink.gif Next week will be a full week again and hopefully I'll be more in shape again.

I will say that they are more of a turn on for me personally. I like having them held/stroked etc, and I like touching them myself. I like unleashing them from their clothing and seeing my husbands reaction. Generally I just like them a lot. Especially now they are getting softer/smushier. I honestly think they are a bigger turn on for me than my husband... but like I said... early days. I'll ask his honest opinion from before/after and let you know smile.gif
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strongirl
post Jan 6 2011, 07:33 PM
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Hey Spot-on, thanks so much for your honest and thorough updates and willingness to share! It is so nice of you to do that for all of us. I'm really glad (and frankly, relieved) that everything went well and that you are so pleased. Whew! Congratulations! Yay! smile.gif

I'm curious though about how or whether it has affected your sex life...and also find it interesting that you didn't even mention that in your 1 month update. So was that not really much of a motivator for you? And how has it been? How has your spouse reacted to them?

When I've thought about implants for myself (which hasn't been often) pretty much my only motivation would be if it would add some extra fun to sex. The oft-mentioned motivators of improved self-confidence, fitting better in clothes, feeling more "normal", don't really resonate with me much. But I love sex and go to some effort to keep my sex life lively and exciting and if implants would promote that, then that would be a plus. However, both my ex-husband and my current bf strongly prefer small natural breasts, so I've known with those relationships at least, it would backfire. The bf has made it quite clear that he is strongly opposed to implants and dearly loves my 34A's. And while it is my body and my decision, I like to keep him happy...and horny. wink.gif
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