[girltrouble]

"International"? How so? He shot in Berlin, Germany & the US.

*sigh*
more crow for me to eat.
*munch*
score: aural 2, gt 0

[TheBeesKnees]

I think the only movie that's come out in theaters for the past few months that's really left any lasting impression on me was Up. I ooohed and ahhhed and laughed and cried...I had tears running down my cleavage I was crying so hard in the beginning. But I'm a sucker like that.

Terminator did not wooh me. I was slightly bummed.

Observe and Report made me laugh really, really hard. And it was a different sort of character for Seth Rogen. I dug that.

Now I'm just excited for Public Enemies and Sherlock Holmes. I fear the latter will disappoint me though.

[auralpoison]

i don't think that bruno really focuses on americans, aural, this movie is supposed to be international.

"International"? How so? He shot in Berlin, Germany & the US. It's fake working title was "Delicious Journeys Through America for the Purpose of Making Heterosexual Males Visibly Uncomfortable in the Presence of a Gay Foreigner in a Mesh T-Shirt".

I suppose it's "international" in the sense that everybody else in the world is being given just one more example of how ridiculous Americans, not just people can be.

[sybarite]

Flying by but wanted to say how much I appreciate the unpacking of why SBC isn't funny and can be offensive from RV and others... especially this:

'I'm not a huge fan of humor that plays on stereotypes, either. I know that sometimes they're attempting to bust those stereotypes, but unfortunately it often backfires and instead exposes many people to stereotypes they weren't aware of before & even reinforces those stereotypes by keeping them alive. It's definitely a double-edged sword.'

Well put.

[Persiflager]

When Ali G first appeared on telly, there were a lot of kids at my school who didn't realise SBC was playing a character. Some of them didn't notice he wasn't black!

[girltrouble]

rose, i don't think there is a contradiction there, (and i love strangers, btw), i agree with you. i see nothing wrong with what colbert does, and from what i have heard, he talks to each guest beforehand, saying, "you know how this works right? i pretend to be an idiot." or some such. they are in on the joke, but even if they weren't, i think the rules are different for public figures. they should be fair game. normal citizens, bigoted or not, deserve a fair shake, imho, not subterfuge.

[chachaheels]

I still haven't seen the Borat film because of the way it was made.

I know satire can be a very powerful tool for social change by way of changing our perceptions of the things we accept and believe unquestioningly. But I always got the impression that when Borat undertook satiric comedy, he did it in such a way that the idea of challenging those perceptions deserves a lot of contempt. He's kind of like a bully who's figured out he can get away with everything he does if he can make most of the people who aren't his targets laugh at the ones who are. Then they can all gang up on the targets if they manage to many any kind of protest in their own defense.

I also can't get away from the fact that he's always making himself the laughable idiot from some notably marginalized group.
He does come from an extremely privileged background. So that makes me wonder.

[stargazer]

I never understood the hype of Sasha Baron Cohen. I never found Ali G funny. I do not think he is a talented comedian nor political or meaningful in his humor. I think most comedians who are truly gifted can receded into their roles, stand on their own, and play well in a troupe. Comedic actors that I tend to appreciate seem to be very private and quiet in real life. I guess I'm thinking of Steve Martin or Eddie Murphy or Robin Williams. Robin Williams can be irritating at times, but, I really think he is gifted with taking one line and running with it. He also has the ability to act in some great dramatic roles.

I just don't see that level of depth with SBC's sense of humor. It is very one note. Plus, I'm not a fan of preying on every day people who have no choice of participating (or receiving monies) from his gags. Has he ever done his own standup show without the use of the public or famous/infamous people? Just curious.

[roseviolet]

GT, as I wrote that I was definitely aware of the contradiction I may be presenting, seeing as I have Stephen Colbert as my avatar. But that's from Strangers With Candy so it doesn't count!!!

All kidding aside, Colbert & The Daily Show definitely do similar things as SBC in some of their interviews, but they seem to realize that a little of this kind of humor can go a long way. They may spend 5 minutes on one of those cringe-worthy interviews, but then they move on. I'm not a huge fan of those interviews (I prefer the ones where the interviewee is clearly in on the joke), but at least that isn't their only gimmick. They use other tactics to get a laugh or make a point. Plus, sometimes they're positive and make a worthwhile contribution (like Colbert's WristStrong bracelets).

I'm not a huge fan of humor that plays on stereotypes, either. I know that sometimes they're attempting to bust those stereotypes, but unfortunately it often backfires and instead exposes many people to stereotypes they weren't aware of before & even reinforces those stereotypes by keeping them alive. It's definitely a double-edged sword.

[girltrouble]

i think that may have been the most interesting (and accurate) take on SBC that i've ever read, rose. although to some degree, you could say that about steven colbert, but-- and this is why i like colbert better-- he goes after public figures, politicians and celebs, and i think there is a sort of generosity that shines thru when he's talking to say, an a-political author. i know SBC used to do the public figure thing, but he seems to focus on average people now. i don't think that bruno really focuses on americans, aural, this movie is supposed to be international.

another thing that bugs me is that SBC trades on stereotypes, for all his supposed social commentary, he makes those ideas about those groups deeper in this movie-- gays, blacks, and who knows who else, with no deeper meaning or intent than to say, these people are just as we thought they were, how funny! it's easy to take on those groups-- arabs? is that a difficult target? even if he takes on his own jewishness, it is the broadest stereotype with the smallest population-- the hasidim. he has little fear of a backlash or saying anything meaningful or deep.

[ketto]

RoseV, you always have such a way of putting things just right. That's my problem with him too. I never actually saw Borat, but I have seen his show and some clips from the movie. I find the embarrassment and use of unsuspecting people pretty slimy. It makes me cringe a bit.

[flanker_ji]

Y'know, I couldn't figure out what it was that bothered me about SBC, and I think you articulated the issue I have with him perfectly, RV.

Everyone I talked to LOVED Borat, said they laughed their asses off. As I watched it, I barely laughed out loud because I was cringing most of the time, trying to figure out what all the hype was about (and I'm a HUGE fan of sophomoric comedy). I guess Bruno will be more of the same...

[roseviolet]

To me the comedy isn't so much about a flamboyant homosexual, it's more about how fucking stupid & backwards Americans are. I have this creeping sense of shame about it.

That's certainly part of his formula. I think it's about more than just showing the stupidity of people (be they American or otherwise). I think he also likes to show how much shit people are willing to overlook for the sake of politeness. He laughs at their kindness. But then if they've had enough and they call him on his shit, then they're still mocked - sometimes more so than if they'd just remained polite. I understand why other people find this amusing, but it just makes me cringe. I can handle that kind of humor in small doses, but definitely not for the length of a whole movie.

I have to admit that I'm not a big fan of Sasha Baron Cohen. He reminds me of the most irritating people in improv teams - the control freaks who feel a need to lead and take over each improvisation (which is a horrendous contradiction, I know, which is why it's annoying and awful). SBC goes out of his way to expose other people to painfully embarrassing situations. However, he is not willing to make himself vulnerable. He always has to be in control. He always has to be in on the joke. And he's very unwilling to expose himself - his true self - to intimate, personal ridicule. Sure, he'll put his characters in embarrassing situations, but that's very different. He's not exposing any of his own personal information or opinion. He even alters his appearance so he's practically unrecognizable. And he's extremely consistent with this. I've never even seen Sasha Baron Cohen give an interview to a journalist while out of character. He's extremely protective of himself & his private life, but he doesn't extend that same protection to his victims. It puts a bad taste in my mouth. It's all so painfully unbalanced.

[Persiflager]

But the trailer for Bruno looks so funny!

I went to see The Hangover at the weekend, and laughed painfully hard.

ETA: My SBC shame is that I watched Ali G when he was first on The 11 O'clock Show, and joined my fellow teens in perfecting the hand/slap/crack gesture. While saying 'Ai'.

[auralpoison]

Okay, so I am torn about Bruno. I mean, I know it's gonna be funny. I remember being hip to SBC's schtick back in the early '00s & enjoying it then. BUT. I keep seeing these articles popping up about Bruno & it's reflection on the gays, but I'm more interested in it's reflections on Americans. The whole world thinks we're a bunch of psychotic, gun-toting, bible-quoting lunatics & Borat/Bruno seem to only further establish that point. To me the comedy isn't so much about a flamboyant homosexual, it's more about how fucking stupid & backwards Americans are. I have this creeping sense of shame about it.

[kari]

I saw Up yesterday and absolutely loved it. What I really liked about it was that there was no crude humor that you often find in movies in the genre. No burping, farting, etc for laughs. It was much more mature, in that sense.

I especially enjoyed the short they showed before the movie. Very sweet.

[girl_logic]

I watched the original version of The Taking of Pelham 123 tonight on TV, and enjoyed it. Liked Walter Matthau's crabbiness, liked how calm and cool Robert Shaw was, all the vintage 70's New York stuff, old train cars, a much younger Jerry Stiller, etc...

hehe my favourite line is "What do they expect for their 75 cents? To live forever!?" I learned everything I knew about New York from those gritty grainy badly lit 70's and early 80's movies they used to make there.

So hey am I in the right thread? I'm looking forward to the Disney movie with the black princess "Frog Prince". I'm setting the bar low to accommodate Disney stereotypes, but maybe it'll surprise.

[anna k]

candycane_girl, I saw a clip of an interview Denzel did about how he eats ice cream pints, and I assumed they got on that topic for weight gain for the movie. He sounded so enthusiatic about his ice cream it was adorable.

I liked the Reese/cyborg scenes in Terminator 4, but felt bored by John Connor, and couldn't stand Moon Bloodgood's character. It was a fun action movie, but not great.

I watched the original version of The Taking of Pelham 123 tonight on TV, and enjoyed it. Liked Walter Matthau's crabbiness, liked how calm and cool Robert Shaw was, all the vintage 70's New York stuff, old train cars, a much younger Jerry Stiller, etc.

No, I didn't see Crank 2. I didn't think it was worth paying for.

[candycane_girl]

anna, I haven't seen the movie but I read an article about how much Denzel enjoyed putting on weight for the role.

I finally saw Terminator Salvation a few days ago and I loved it! The funny thing is that I have never seen all of the original one but I grew up watching Terminator Judgment Day over and over again. I liked the few throwbacks they made to the earlier movies.

There were a lot of little things I liked about the movie. Like the random inclusion of Helena Bonham Carter, the stuff that made me jump in my seat and the fact that they really showed the Terminators a lot (although the look of them has always freaked me out. And of course I loved that they had Arnold in there. I don't know if it was CGI or what.

When I had first heard about the movie being in production I wasn't sure if it would be any good (the third one was dreadful) but I was pleasantly surprised.

[girltrouble]

lol... i'm curious if he would have sounded better reading something from 'dianetics'. yeah, the yelling thing is another thing i don't like about sam and john.

and i adore 70's grit in movies. seemed more real to me.

did you ever end up seeing crank2, anna?