[karategrrl]

Arrrrgh, just what the world needs--another vehicle for the objectification of women.

http://www.lflus.com/

[KeraBear]

LMFAO! You peeps are terrible... but in a good way.

[just_a_guy]

Yep, porn IS a really hot button--touches everyone in some way (or should I say some touch themselves, ha)?!

No comment

@Kera: insert either "you're MOM hijacked this thread" or "you can hijack my thread any day" comment here.

[karategrrl]

Yep, porn IS a really hot button--touches everyone in some way (or should I say some touch themselves, ha)?!

[KeraBear]

On a side note, I don't think anybody said kera overreacted because it bothered her that her BF was looking at porn. I know I suggested that she might have reacted more agressively than she would have over just pornography because of the other things going on in her life at that particular moment (only kera can truly answer that one).

Yea, my really bad day made me react more aggressively for sure. How would i reacted on a normal day? I dunno. But my feelings were real anyways. I just could have expressed them better.

Ha ha, i highjacked this thread singlehandedly for awhile, didn't I? So true that porn is a hot button issue... fortunately Starship showed up just in time to bring the topic around to more fun things! Nipple tassles, anyone? LOL!!

And on Karategrrl's last comment. Umm... ouch? *shudders*

[karategrrl]

Was it the one with the artist who was casting them in plaster?

Hmmm, no, don't remember that. Though I saw it on YouTube so maybe it was not the full version?

Hope this is not TMI, but a few days ago I had a mole removed from near my naughty bits (that's why I was at the GYN). Even with a local anesthetic, it HURT. I cannot imagine the pain of actually having part of your labia cut off.

[just_a_guy]

The doc was made in the UK, though I'm not there. Someone posted a link to it in the "vages of all shapes and sizes" thread.

Was it the one with the artist who was casting them in plaster?

[karategrrl]

Out of curiosity, are you in the UK? (or was the documentary you saw produced there?) I ask because I've seen a a number of documentaries out of the UK on just that issue (and in particular how the procedure is on the rise in the UK) in the past few years, and in progressively younger women.

The doc was made in the UK, though I'm not there. Someone posted a link to it in the "vages of all shapes and sizes" thread.

[just_a_guy]

Hahaha, that is AWESOME. let us know how it turns out.

And I apologize, JAG, in my comment about hypocrisy in the male species. Of course there are hypocrites of every gender. I was venting. It's just something that personally, honestly I've seen in a ratio of a billion to one in favor of men. Maybe that has (unfortunately) just been my personal experience, and I do acknowledge that.

This is remotely related to breast size (in the sense of body acceptance)--I was at my friendly GYN yesterday and I mentioned a documentary I'd seen about labiaplasty, and how women get the impression there's something wrong with their naughty bits becuase they're comparing their bodies to ALTERED images. My doc said he has young girls come in to him asking him to "trim" them a little, then went on to describe a doctor at the hospital he works who was dismissed for doing just that, and he said the hospital "would not tolerate that nonsense," etc. and went on to vent a bit about how stupid it is for people to judge their bodies and to say how much variety there is and how it's all good, etc. He didn't know about the porn/photoshopped images thing, so I told him about it--he really listened intently.

I must say my respect for him went up a serious notch yesterday. I started out with a female gyno and kind of went to him reluctantly at first. I've come to really like him.

No harm, no foul. I'm sure I've done the exact same thing at one point or another (probably when venting about divorce or custody laws that blindly favor women) and, on the particular issue of porn, you may be right that there is significantly more hypocrisy in men. I tend to have the idea stuck in my head that more men than women are hypocritical about reciprocating oral sex (which may or may not be true, I honestly don't know), but the truth is that it's based on anecdotal data at best, so I try to state that when I start running my mouth about it.

I try my best to be objective when I rant

Out of curiosity, are you in the UK? (or was the documentary you saw produced there?) I ask because I've seen a a number of documentaries out of the UK on just that issue (and in particular how the procedure is on the rise in the UK) in the past few years, and in progressively younger women.

To bring the thread fully back on topic, a friend of mine forwarded a link to me about a documentary entitled "My Small Breasts and I," but I haven't had a chance to watch it through yet.

[karategrrl]

Anywho, I only really popped in to tell you all that i ordered some......NIPPLE TASSELS! lol. To be honest it was only an impulse buy to make an online order enough to qualify for free postage, but I'm still a bit excited. Should be fun to try...

Hahaha, that is AWESOME. let us know how it turns out.

And I apologize, JAG, in my comment about hypocrisy in the male species. Of course there are hypocrites of every gender. I was venting. It's just something that personally, honestly I've seen in a ratio of a billion to one in favor of men. Maybe that has (unfortunately) just been my personal experience, and I do acknowledge that.

This is remotely related to breast size (in the sense of body acceptance)--I was at my friendly GYN yesterday and I mentioned a documentary I'd seen about labiaplasty, and how women get the impression there's something wrong with their naughty bits becuase they're comparing their bodies to ALTERED images. My doc said he has young girls come in to him asking him to "trim" them a little, then went on to describe a doctor at the hospital he works who was dismissed for doing just that, and he said the hospital "would not tolerate that nonsense," etc. and went on to vent a bit about how stupid it is for people to judge their bodies and to say how much variety there is and how it's all good, etc. He didn't know about the porn/photoshopped images thing, so I told him about it--he really listened intently.

I must say my respect for him went up a serious notch yesterday. I started out with a female gyno and kind of went to him reluctantly at first. I've come to really like him.

[starship]

Hmm, I'm undecided on the porn issue. I kind of agree with everyone lol. Each relationship is different though so I couldn't 100% say I don't mind my bf watching porn/that I would ask him not to etc. I definitely couldn't see myself with someone who was obsessive and couldn't live without it. I think it would get to me too much on my down days.

Anywho, I only really popped in to tell you all that i ordered some......NIPPLE TASSELS! lol. To be honest it was only an impulse buy to make an online order enough to qualify for free postage, but I'm still a bit excited. Should be fun to try...

[just_a_guy]

Hey buttercups, it was really interesting to read your take on things. I 100% agree that if you are not comfortable with your BF looking at porn, and he feels that you don't have a right to weigh in on his decision, then you are probably not compatible. I just don't think either of you are wrong.

I think that is equally true regarding what karategrrl said (although I do take issue with attributing hypocrisy solely to men. Hypocrites come in all shapes sizes colors, and genders). Everybody has there own definition of what porn is. I personally don't care if a girl I'm dating wants to sleep on a stack of Playgirls (or something more hardcore for that matter) in place of a mattress. Personally, it's that level of security that I have to have in order to know the relationship is healthy. I know myself, and I know that if I'm feeling insecure about that, or about my girl hanging out with her guy friends, or any of the other stuff that people get bent out of shape over, then it points to a deeper problem of trust within my relationship, and that is what I need to address.

Beyond the issue of personal insecurity, porn is one of those hot-button issues (in the same vein as abortion, religion, or political alignment) for some people. My mother can't stand it. She thinks it is absolutely degrading to women, and hates the idea of it. At the same time, I doubt that she has had any real exposure to it. My sister, simultaneously doesn't mind it at all. She thinks that, while there may be problems with the reality of the porn industry and the forces that motivate women into performance, there are quite a few women in porn who should be feminist figureheads, ostensibly refusing to allow patriarchal dictation of what they do with their bodies, express themselves sexually, or earn their living.

I can certainly see the validity of both arguments. I also agree that ugly dudes detract significantly from the viewing experience. Unfortunately, I haven't gotten any word back on whether or not I can step in and replace them yet (maybe I need an agent).

On a side note, I don't think anybody said kera overreacted because it bothered her that her BF was looking at porn. I know I suggested that she might have reacted more agressively than she would have over just pornography because of the other things going on in her life at that particular moment (only kera can truly answer that one).

SG - way to out my porn habits in front of a room full of women

[KeraBear]

Thanks SG! *blushing* "Because they are willingly naked." Ha ha... tru! I guess if i preferred anything at least let my BF appreciate the amateur form. You know, something "real" instead of that fake airbrushed crap

hey i really enjoy the reading the different perspectives from you alll good stuff!

[strongirl]

Lapis, that was a very profound and refreshing perspective and I thank you for posting it. The idea that it would be concerning to be attractive to one's partner just because of being a "type" is one I hadn't really thought about but it's valid and I know I'll think about it more. And the things you said about appreciating the uniqueness and energy and chemistry between you. That perspective dismantles the whole pressure to be someone's perfect ideal or the epitome of their body type preference - powerful stuff! Forget perfection. It's the magic between you that matters.

My bf has a huge collection of pics of women and I've always had a positive reaction to the amazing variety in his collection - it conveys to me that he likes women, period. He has more "candid" or amateur stuff than actual "models" and few fake boobs. These women have flaws - chub, weird proportions, etc. He still likes to look at them and why? Because they're willingly naked.

Kera - you are so cool and that bf of yours sounds like a keeper. You are light years ahead of most people your age and for that matter, any age.

[KeraBear]

Or maybe I'll just punch the next person who makes fun of me. KA-POWW!

Yeeeeeeeeeeeeessss!!!

Buttercups: Yes, it still bothers me somewhat. Honestly, i am still trying to work out how i feel about porn because as you know from my past post, i really feel what you are sayingl! And my BF has offered to stop and he knows that i can change my mind if i really wanted to.

JAG: Thanks for a guy point of view. It really was helpful. You are such a brainiac (That was supposed to be a compliment. LOL)

[karategrrl]

I guess my point is that you don't have to just "accept" that your guy will look at porn. It's ok for it to bother you, it bothers many women- myself included. If you're truly over it and such then I am happy for you and glad you could overcome it, but don't feel like you necessarily over-reacted or that it's something you have to live with because "boys will be boys" and all that bullshit.

Thanks for sharing that. I do agree. Everyone has the right to their opinion, and whatever it is, it should be respected. And I SOOOOO hate that "boys will be boys" or "I can't help it, I'm a guy" crap. It's like women who blame everything on PMS.

Recently my stepson (about 24) came over with his new GF. He told his dad and I about a friend of his whose engagement might be called off due to the fact that his fiance found a Playboy in his sock drawer. Stepson thought it was ridiculous and blamed it on her being Mormon. My husband then agreed that it was stupid and said, "that's not even porn." Later I asked hubby about it and he apparently defines "porn" as sex acts depicted between two people--not airbrushed fantasy photos of solo women. Crap. Such crap. what bugs me most is the hypocrisy--I'd be willing to bet a day's pay that any man would be at least a little rattled to find Playgirl or such in his woman's sock drawer. I cannot see any man just brushing that off and saying," oh, that's not even porn" and "wow, that guys's got a huge weiner, but I still feel totally confident about mine, even though it's half the size!" Seriously, now I'm venting, but what goes up my ass sideways is men's hypocrisy. I've seen it a billion times. (No offense to your species, Just a Guy!)

KeraBear, very glad it worked out. It's great when the crap events in relationships can morph into something better that improves the whole relationship overall.

[buttercups]

Sorry I'm late into the conversation and really glad it was resolved for you Kera, but I have a different perspective on things.

I have felt exactly like you and had a similar situation where I found porn on my ex-bfs computer. I found out he would be with me for a little bit during the night, then go home and look at porn- and of course all big fake boobs and such. It really hurt me and I definitely reacted to it. I felt completely inadequate and I have to say I still would. I find most porn to be extremely sexist and some guys do internalize that fake "ideal" and think all women look that way or there is something wrong with them. This ex of mine also was sexually aggressive and he even attributed it to porn himself. I felt very uncomfortable having him see my body and yes I am more insecure than a lot of the wonderful ladies on here, but it was a big problem for me feeling like I was being compared to fake images of "the perfect woman". For me it had to stop because I was definitely not ok with it and even today don't think I would be. I think maybe if I was someone more comfortable in my body that would be possible, but with the body I have - seeing my guy get off to something I don't and will never even resemble in the slightest is hard. I have very deep-rooted insecurities and can't pretend like they aren't there. Not to mention the fact that it pisses me off that a lot of porn is all these stereotypically "hot" chicks with ugly dudes ( even if they have big dicks- which don't turn me on anyways, they are still usually ugly guys).

I guess my point is that you don't have to just "accept" that your guy will look at porn. It's ok for it to bother you, it bothers many women- myself included. If you're truly over it and such then I am happy for you and glad you could overcome it, but don't feel like you necessarily over-reacted or that it's something you have to live with because "boys will be boys" and all that bullshit. If by any chance it still bothers you, have a talk with him and see what you can work out. Once I confessed to my ex-bf how much it hurt me and my insecurities he stopped doing it of his own free will, and that definitely helped me feel a little better in our relationship. Just offering you another perspective because hey that's what we're here for right!

[just_a_guy]

That's really great news kera

[nbdx0645]

That's such great news, Kera.

Edit: For college, I went to UIUC, which was a very good opportunity for me. Unfortunately, I lived in a very party-centric location. It wouldn't have been quite as bad if I lived away from the Fratville. We had issues with students throwing parties that centered around racism and, of course, hazing. College is a polarized place. You have some of the best and brightest...and then you have the mean party animals.

I do feel bad if I rained on your parade. I got angry when I recalled those experiences. I attended school for 4 years, and I had one idiot yell at me across the street, and a so-called-friend made fun of me. I had a few 'well-meaning remarks' and a couple people who commented on their lilliputian-ness. That's really not so bad. Now I can look back and say "this is who I am" and apply that self-assurance to other situations. Or maybe I'll just punch the next person who makes fun of me. KA-POWW!

College is a great adventure.

[KeraBear]

nbdx0645 - Thanks for being so truthful about your college experience, even though it did rain on my parade!. That guy that drove by yelling at you is such a jerkface! I hope it did not discourage you from your rollerblading routine or from the comfort of your outfit so that you never wore it again. If so, then they win! And that's bad! What I want to know is what college did you go to, so that I can cross it off my list of potential places to apply this year! geeeeez