[Aithinne]

Troll. End of.

NEXT!!!

[Aithinne]

Re-read the responses you get in here over and over, rather than cycling on your own negative thoughts.

I agree.. You need to repeat the positive as much as you are repeating the negative garbage. Re-read! It does help! Make the good stuff stick in there, read it until you have it memorized!

[Aithinne]

Ok, I'm totally confused by this pip person and why pip is even here..??? Is there a point to his posts?

Anyway... Back to our regularly scheduled programming.

A few days ago I saw this REALLY good looking guy and he was with this gorgeous girl, but guess what- no breastage at all!! It made me happy to see the itty bitty girls getting the studs. I almost felt like clapping at them in public, but they would have had no idea what I was clapping for, and it would have been awkward to explain. Lol.

Moral of my story, celebrate the small boobie lovers buttercups! They ARE out there! Positive positive positive girl!! For every negative thought, say something positive until the positive becomes more frequent than the negative. It feels a little strange at first to say good things about your boobs, kind of like you're lying to yourself, but just trust me. Say it anyway. And look at those little things when you say it. Spread the boobie lovin.

*Boobie high-two coming your way*

[auralpoison]

/derail

OZ did have a LOT of peen on it, didn't it though? I'm surprised that we are getting practically no peen elsewhere. I mean, Hung is called Hung for a reason, right? Wherefore art thou peen?

[Persephone3]

"God am I full of rants or what? sorry to anyone who may have become offended by my man-bashing. There are plenty of men in my life that I love, but I would be lying to say deep down inside I don't have this dislike for men boiling inside me. I've also experienced some sexual abuse in my life that may have contributed to this and im sure many of my other issues- but I can't use this as a full excuse. Men get to live with a freedom that I don't have and for that they make me so angry. But if they ever start putting male full frontal in my HBO show then maybe i'll feel justice has been served haha."
[/quote]

Hi All,
I agree with so much of the wonderful advice that has been given here. But sexual abuse is very serious and could be the root cause of a lot of your problems. Surpressed emotions may manifest themself in the critical nature of your own body. You may want to consult a therapist, because you deserve to be happy and feel good about yourself. You would be surprised that when you start to deal with your issues, how it can change your whole perspective. But I believe all of this has already been said.

I too get very angry towards men, but I also feel angry towards the women that let themselves be exploited. I read somewhere that since women have been repressed the only power they feel they have is sexual power. Hopefully that is changing. I believe that we have made great progress, but we have a long way to go.

BTW - I have seen a lot of male nudity on HBO. More so than other networks. The show OZ had tons of it!

Pip - If you don't have a problem with your body (good for you), then why are you here?

[lightchested]

Buttercups,

Looks like if things don't work out with your boyfriend, Pip is available. On the off-chance that Pip is a female, she has obviously never walked a mile in our bra.

But enough of that.

When you went for therapy for BDD did you talk about your breasts specifically?
I sure did, and I told them (all) point blank "my boobs are wrecking my life".

how did you do it?
Well, I went to a few docs about it. I seem to recollect having to tell the receptionist-type person over the phone just to get the appointment for one or two of the places. For all of them, there is "intake" paperwork that you fill out when you get there. It's lengthy! It asks if you've had suicidal thoughts, if anyone in your family has committed suicide, if you're on any meds, how often you feel depressed, etc. It actually gets pretty detailed and makes your hand tired and brain worn out. I considered giving up on therapy just to be able to walk out & not have to finish those forms. But I did them every time. One doc made me draw myself as I see myself. As you'd imagine, that was a beauty of a picture.

Anyway, you write it on this intake paperwork, so when the doc calls you in, s/he looks at the paperwork, and goes, "So you have a problem with your breasts?" or whatever. And you go "yeah". And it goes from there.

were you embarrassed?
Of all the gifts God has given me, one of the ones I'm most grateful for is that I rarely, if ever, embarrass. I wish I could explain why. I've tried to help other people not feel embarrassment, but don't know how to convey the "who cares?" right-to-the-core attitude to them. I just don't care what people think of me. I don't know why. But I'm very grateful for it. One thing I do sometimes, when something is really hard, is act. Literally. Take yourself out of yourself, and say the things you need to say, but do it as though you're playing a part. When you're comfortable again, reconverge. Usually it only takes a few minutes of "acting" to get past the scary thing, and then you see there are no dire consequences, so you can "be yourself" again, and feel comfortable. Does this sound weird? I do it in situations in which I am very uncomfortable, and it gets me through. Oh, one other thing...keep in mind you are ALWAYS free to leave. At any time, at any point, during any conversation or situation. So there need be no fear. You can always just leave. So plunge ahead & see what happens. I always tells myself, "There is nothing to fear but every mirror...I mean fear itself!!!" (I have a weird sense of humor sometimes)

I've tried talking to a few people in my life about this that i trust the most, but they either don't get it or think i'm being vain or something.
BDD is commonly mistaken for vanity, when in fact, as you know, it is the exact polar opposite! No, people don't get it. They just don't.

I don't think anyone in my life really understands how debilitating this can be for me and how much it impacts my relationships.
I don't even know you and I know you are 100% correct in this statement. Same with me. Sometimes when I list to people how it has impacted my life, my choices, it makes their jaws drop. We connect dots that others do not connect. That is why we take things that other see as "unrelated" and "turn it into" all about our boobs. Our brain makes connections that others' don't.

Ugh Lightchested I relate to you so much when you said sometimes you think you're over it and then something will trigger you- that is how I am exactly! I go for awhile being fine and not caring so much ( putting a lot of effort into not caring mind you)
I too have to put a lot of effort into not caring. I wish not caring were easy! And it's so easy to sink right back to where I started.

and then boom! something will trigger me and I'm a total mess.
yep

I've found for me a trigger is usually a stupid movie like Beerfest that I'm forced to watch in a group or being around guy friends who talk about boobs or seeing a naked chick on tv with my bf. Or sometimes I will have suppressed the feeling for so long that I just erupt and lash out and go through a terrible night of hating my body. Then the next day I wake up and I'm all right again. I'm scared to get therapy bc I'm so embarrassed. I wish there was something else I could do.
Okay, same with me, all. Therapy gave me coping mechanisms, but didn't cure me. I too wish I could get this thing out of me.

[auralpoison]

who is 'we'? is this a private group for 3 people?
It IS being discussed and solely through mind-reading attempts, which is silly.
the overwrought pompous reaction to other supportive contributors just looks obnoxious.

"Overwrought pompous . . . looks obnoxious". Pip meet kettle. Kettle meet Pip. Ya'll should get along famously.

[angie_21]

Hi Pip, not that your wonderfully enlightening comment deserves a response, but the whole point of this forum is to try to steer ourselves away from caring about what men think. When it comes to a topic about women's bodies, we can't help but end up talking about what men think once in a while, but that's actually the opposite of what we want. We want to focus on how we feel about our own bodies, and it's actually really sad and pathetic that it always veers back to what men think, because that's what we've been socialized to care about. If this furom were full of men giving us their opinions, we wouldn't reach those goals at all. Clearly you didn't even read everything posted here, or you would have figured it out for yourself.

Buttercups, there is nothing wrong with being a feminist. And if you've been abused in the past, it's no wonder you're angry. Just don't let that anger take over your life. Right now you are taking that anger and turning it back on yourself, because you don't have healthy way to get rid of it or deal with it. Instead of getting angry with destructive thought patterns, think constructively about how you can make your life better. Replace angry thoughts about men with positive thoughts about how you can feel powerful and in control of yourself and your sexuality. I was lucky enough to learn the power of positive affirmations before I even knew anything about psychology or pop psychology, or what it all means. But it has helped me get through a lot in life, and probably stopped me from becoming as certifable as most of my relatives. It is true, tell yourself something a thousand times, and you will believe it. You've told yourself you're "defective" for a long time, and you can't stop negative thought patterns overnight, but keep at it and slowly you will start thinking more positively without trying!

I actually have some pretty strong feelings about all the same things you are concerned about with feminism, I just don't usually discuss them with people I'm not very, very comfortable with, and I've learned to keep my thoughts & feelings under control the same way I keep my other liberal, leftist, atheist, and otherwise un-Christian views under control so as not to walk around offending people and alienating myself from others all day. There is a fine line between being passionate about topics that affect my life, and letting myself be angry and miserable about things I can't directly change. What I can do is try to encourage other women not to fall into the traps society sets for us, and don't let men off the hook when they are being chauvinistic, and as strongirl says, have the best "revenge" by living well and being happy. My (less polite) way of thinking about it is "don't let the bastards get you down" (thank you Kris Kristofferson for bringing this phrase to my attention!)

[buttercups]

You all have given me such great advice and I am going to try to do all of the things you have suggested. I know that many of you wonderful women have surpassed this issue and now accept yourselves and that does make me feel like I can do it too. Angie_21 it really made me feel almost reassured when you said that I am normal, that is something I've always found hard to believe. It's so silly but I've spent a lot of time thinking that I was born transgendered or something bc I've found my body to be so abnormal. I did need someone to tell me that I'm normal, even though you've never seen me, and it helps and I've been reminding myself of that since you said it. I had an appt with the OB/GYN today and for some reason I always expect her to say that something about me is abnormal, but she never has. It's stupid but I need to almost be convinced that I am 100% female and hearing you say that and then going to the doctor today and having her see nothing out of the ordinary for female anatomy makes me believe it more.

I've also never heard any other women talk about how male-dominated everything is today. It's great to feel that you all understand me and I know I have to stop letting the bullshit get to me before I go insane. I already lash out at my bf who is a great guy and he doesn't deserve it and I don't deserve him bc I take all my anger at the male species out on him. I have to learn to be as understanding as you Karategrrl and just realize that naked women are everywhere, men look at them, and maybe it doesn't mean anything. I wish I could turn my brain off sometimes before I let it get all angry feminist bitch. I'm going to look for those things by Louise Hay- I'll take all the help I can get and if you recommend it then I know its def worth a shot.

I want to get over this sooooooo bad. I want to be positive everyday and not cringe when my bf touches me or imagine what people are thinking about me in their heads. Theyre just stupid breasts! I just want to live my life and maybe take the self-hatred away in the process. You all change my thinking and give me something to look foward to when I can finally free myself from making a lack of tissue the center of my life.

[karategrrl]

buttercups, I've gone through my own feelings of bitterness and hatred toward men, men's magazines, and the male-oriented world we do live in. I once went on a huge quest to find a women's magazine--any one at all--that had nude or near-nude pics of men as a regular "feature" like they do in men's magazines--you know, the bikini layouts that are as "normal" as the financial advice or motorcycle maintenance columns. There aren't any! There's Playgirl, but that's clearly all nudity. (Hubby and I once had a major fight b/c he bought a copy of Easy Riders. I was appalled to have that trash in the house and doubly appalled when he said it was "no big deal" when I confronted him.)

Let me make this clear--I don't think it's fair, nor do I think the objectification of women or anyone is okay and acceptable, but I have come to realize men are so bombarded by women as "decoration" that it really isn't as big a deal to them as we may think. Men enjoy naked women and I think they're aware and appreciate of the fact that women's images are so available to them in so many venues. Yet I think on some level they're also aware that a lot of it is dumb and stereotypical, and even comical. Since they are easily aroused, on another level they may actually resent being manipulated by these images, and to some degree resent the women who do so. In groups, they do their chest-thumping and make a big deal over breasts and whatever else, but that may not be how any of them really feel; I think men generally aren't as honest with each other as women are, and it's a shame they feel they have to put up a front. That behavior is not okay, but I find it helps to look behind all the machismo at the causes, and it doesn't make me as mad.

I KNOW it is difficult--believe me--but do listen to the great advice and support everyone here is giving you. (And let me say, my admiration for all of you has grown by leaps and bounds for reaching out to our sis buttercups.) No, some things in this world aren't fair and you have no or little control over them. But take back your power over the things you DO have control over--one of them being your mental well-being.

I agree with whoever it was who promoted the healthy self-talk. Personally, this has been of HUGE benefit for me with some of life's difficulties and, to some extent, my booby esteem. I'm not talking about the "name it and claim it" philosophy, like "Think you have big breasts, and you will grow them," but rather replacing all those negative thoughts with positive ones.

Have you listened to any CDs or read anything by Louise Hay? I highly recommend it. She is, in my book, the Affirmation Queen. I recommend her "You Can Heal Your Life affirmation kit." Comes with an audio CD that is a great intro to positive affirmations. (No, this is not a paid endorsement.)

[strongirl]

I have to say I am absolutely blown away by the wisdom, caring, and insight of the women in this thread. You all (including you, Buttercups - you are struggling so hard and so valiently) restore my faith in humankind.

Counseling can be very helpful, Buttercups, but the advice you just got from Aithinne, Lightchested, and Angie_21 is, in my opinion, more thoughtful, deeper, and just better than what you'd get from most of the therapists out there. Re-read the responses you get in here over and over, rather than cycling on your own negative thoughts.

As for anger at men about porn and sexual oppression, I agree with Angie - to not have at least some of it you'd have to have your head up your own butt. But there's no reason to let it ruin your life. What happens outside your head is not within your control, but what happens inside your own head is totally under your control. And to get past these issues and be happy is the goal. I've always loved the saying:

"Living well is the best revenge."

[angie_21]

If I had boobs and fit into this world would I hate it as much- honestly I doubt it. Every girl I know who has a chest can watch all those shows and porn and everything and they don't seem to shrivel up and die inside like I do. I wish I didn't feel these feelings towards men and I know its bad of me, but I can't help it.

Aithinne and strongirl say it pretty well perfectly, but here goes anyways.

Oh honey. Believe me, I have friends with big boobs who are simply terrified of the idea of porn, and are extremely threatened by it. The thing is, there will always be another person out there with bigger boobs, longer legs, a smaller waist, a cuter nose. We have to accept that. I mean, you think things are bad now, what are we going to do when we're gray-haired and wrinkly and saggy, and every 25 year old out there looks more "beautiful" than we do? Well, we're going to have to start valuing ourselves to reasons other than how we look, or like Aithinne said, we've doomed ourselves to a life of unhappiness. You have to realise, fully and completely, that you are not missing out on anything. While you are wondering what it's like to have big boobs, other girls are wondering how their life would have been different 30 pounds lighter or with a smaller nose, bluer eyes, a prettier smile, or any other thing out there. We are all only hurting ourselves this way, and the only thing holding you back from enjoying your youth and being sexy is yourself, your obsession, and your fear.

I don't know if you can beleive me, but I used to have a lot of the characteristics lightchested mentioned of BDD. I spent a lot of time worrying about my boobs. I felt like I wasn't sexy, wasn't good enough, couldn't wear certain clothes, I measured them every day to see if they would grow. And I did get over it. But it wasn't magic. It took strength in the face of the constant barrage of advertising and asshole young men, and it took my accepting myself for who I am. You have to remind yourself about all of these things. You have to be strong enough that these things that bug you, can just roll off your back instead. It takes time, and can't happen overnight, but you really have to stop wishing for an answer and take charge of you own life & body, and take responsibility for your own hurtful thoughts.

It is still a man's world. It sucks sometimes, and you don't have to feel bad for being resentful about it. Any woman who thinks she doesn't have a reason to be resentful, has her head up her own butt. The thing is, the way to get along in a man's world without succumbing to it, is to be yourself. The sterotype of what a woman is supposed to be is the victim and the opressed figure in the man's world. Do you really want to be "womanly" in that way? Having bigger boobs just so you can feel like you can fit more smoothly into the stereotype of the hottie/supportive girlfriend/obedient housewife/loving martyred mother, won't make you happier. The more you fit the stereotype, the easier it is to fall into being opressed and treated like an object. And being treated like an object, is what allows us to judge ourselves based on our appearance in the first place. Don't wish men were treated as much like objects as women, wish that people would stop allowing themselves to be commodified and commercialized, and that they would treat themselves and eachother like human beings instead.

[angie_21]

It's like a body part is missing. I definitely think I've had body dysmorphic disorder for many years due to my obsessing about this problem, but the main definition is worrying about a defect that is "slight or imagined" and I'm pretty sure my defect is real. Whenever I've talked to a bf about this before they say "no its all in your head" but how can it be? Is it all in my head that I can't fill out a bra?? Is it all in my head that my chest never developed?? I mean bra sizes don't lie and maybe I would have BDD if I was a nice full B cup and felt this way- but at a AA arent I a little justified to think that something is missing?

I haven't read anything else up to this point, and probably won't have time until later, but this just needs to be talked about. NO. No, you are not justified. Stop hurting yourself like that. Unless your band and boobie measurements are exactly the same you DO freakin have something there. It may not be what you want, but they are indeed breasts. You're beating yourself up about being "defective" when your body is 100% normal (again, maybe it's not what you want, but it's healthy, and it's even a common chest size - MANY OTHER PEOPLE ARE THE SAME SIZE AS YOU).

It's not your chest size that's all in your head, it's thinking that there's something wrong with your chest size that's all in your head.

[Aithinne]

Sexual abuse will definitely contribute to the problems you're experiencing now. Counseling is your best friend. You shouldn't be ashamed to seek help no matter what the source of your insecurity is. It obviously affects your life greatly. Would you rather say that your anxiety over your small breasts is not important enough to get help? Would you rather live in fear and embarassment your whole life? Or, you could get some professional help who will give you the tools you need to break free of your self-imposed prison.

Culture is what it is. The collective CAN change the culture. But, as a part of the collective, you have to do your part. You have to stop buying into its BS and giving it fuel. You need to stop demonizing everything around you. Forget about the injustice of seeing breasts everywhere and not seeing male nudity. It's not IMPORTANT. And, may I remind you to remember that breasts are not only sexual objects and thinking so harms breast-feeding women everywhere.

Men are not horrible. They like the whole variety of breasts and don't lie to yourself and say that they only like the big ones. Did you read the comments below the lil diddies video that lightchested posted? They are ALL postitive words for small breasts. One man posted a comment on YOUR SIZE: "And as for the the real men of the world we love ALL breasts regardless of frontiers, size, colour, shape.... YAY for AA - Adorable Adornments". Read them every single day. Thinking all those men are lying or that it's some massive joke or conspiracy is just plain silly. I think you should also read this page and this page and take a look at all the positive words from men!

I admit, I've had my serious downs with thinking all men suck, they only want perfect barbies, blah blah blah. But then I snap out of it and slap myself upside the head for my stupidity.

Slap yourself upside the head. After all, you could've had a V8!! Lol....sorry really bad joke.

[buttercups]

Aithinne youre right about all of those things and that is like the slap in the face that i need and I know I should appreciate my body because its healthy and I do try to put it in that perspective a lot- but unfortunately it can't stop me from thinking about it and worrying about it. I've tried and tried and tried and I am thankful that I'm healthy but that can't take my true thoughts about myself away. And you're right I am most definitely dooming my relationship and I have done the exact same thing before, but this hatred of my breasts has somehow made me hate men too in this weird way. It's like I hate them because their desire for boobs makes me hate myself so much because I can't live up to this expectation. I hate men's magazines and how tv shows ALWAYS show boobs but you never see dick and how its so acceptable for women to be naked everywhere but not for men. Even today I was watching my new favorite show True Blood and in this episode there were boobs everywhere but not one naked male full frontal- i mean what the hell! Why is it ok for men to get to oogle something while we're left with nothing- not to mention the fact that the women were all well-endowed. I hate how the world is run by men's exploitation of us and how I can't get away from this image they ( or someone ) has created and how women feed into it and contribute to it even more by posing for Playboy and Hustler and Maxim and god knows what else. I can't stand porn bc its a bunch of big fake tits and as much as there is porn out there that focuses on smallies ive only ever seen guys watching girls with boobs bigger than my head. I guess I just can't stand living in this man's world and yes, it is because of my insecurities. Is it wrong for me to feel that i hate men- of course it is! And it def impacts my relationships bc I just can't make any guy understand and I also lash out at them and blame them for my hatred. If I had boobs and fit into this world would I hate it as much- honestly I doubt it. Every girl I know who has a chest can watch all those shows and porn and everything and they don't seem to shrivel up and die inside like I do. I wish I didn't feel these feelings towards men and I know its bad of me, but I can't help it. A part of me blames them for why things are the way they are and why I feel this way.

Lightchested wow, you are my soul sister! I have read the Broken Mirror and it did help me a little- especially the part about how some women who have BDD feel masculine - which is exactly how my small breasts make me feel. You definitely answered the exact questions I have- it makes sense that its the obsession, not the physical problem, that defines BDD. I definitely definitely have the horrible obsession. I wached your video ( it made me laugh) and I couldn't tell if it was a joke or if those guys really do like smallies, but thanks that was cute. Its really interesting about the ego-dystonia and I do agree that my actual body does not coincide with how I pictured I should be. When you went for therapy for BDD did you talk about your breasts specifically? I'm really embarrassed to get help for this bc it is such an embarrassing topic. I'll feel so stupid going to a psychologist and saying "my lack of boobies is ruining my life!". how did you do it? were you embarrassed? I've tried talkign to a few people in my life about this that i trust the most, but they either don't get it or think i'm being vain or something. I don't think anyone in my life really understands how debilitating this can be for me and how much it impacts my relationships. Ugh Lightchested I relate to you so much when you said sometimes you think you're over it and then something will trigger you- that is how I am exactly! I go for awhile being fine and not caring so much ( putting a lot of effort into not caring mind you) and then boom! something will trigger me and I'm a total mess. I've found for me a trigger is usually a stupid movie like Beerfest that I'm forced to watch in a group or being around guy friends who talk about boobs or seeing a naked chick on tv with my bf. Or sometimes I will have suppressed the feeling for so long that I just erupt and lash out and go through a terrible night of hating my body. Then the next day I wake up and I'm all right again. I'm scared to get therapy bc I'm so embarrassed. I wish there was something else I could do.

God am I full of rants or what? sorry to anyone who may have become offended by my man-bashing. There are plenty of men in my life that I love, but I would be lying to say deep down inside I don't have this dislike for men boiling inside me. I've also experienced some sexual abuse in my life that may have contributed to this and im sure many of my other issues- but I can't use this as a full excuse. Men get to live with a freedom that I don't have and for that they make me so angry. But if they ever start putting male full frontal in my HBO show then maybe i'll feel justice has been served haha.

[lightchested]

Buttercups,

OH girl. We must be soul sisters. I guess we all are on this board, though!

But here's the thing. I can speak to your BDD questions because I've been treated for it. The treatment did not eradicate my concerns about the blobular area, but it did help in some ways. I want to share with you what I learned. Because I had all the same questions as you!!!

First off, reading The Broken Mirror may give you a weird solace. It did me. There were people even worse off than me, in terms of their obsession. I know it's negative to derive solace from that, but I was so down that it was a relief to me to see there was even further to fall, and I knew I'd not fall that far. Strange solace, I know.

Anyway, here we go:

1.) I was constantly asking, "Is this BDD? Because sizes don't lie." Here was the response: if you think about The Area three or more hours per day, it IS BDD. Because you know what? There are people who are missing limbs who think about that less than three hours per day! Or at least, they don't think about it the same way we do. They aren't thinking in terms of aesthetics, but rather in terms of practicalities. (e.g. "I wish I could hold on to my baby in one arm and feed her this lovely green Gerber's gruel with the other" etc.) But we aren't thinking in terms like that, right? We're interested in our aesthetics, and the ramifications/consequences of those aesthetics. Three hours a day! I blew that away. I was easily every waking minute for about a year and a half thinking about it.

2.) But it's a "real" defect, we think, "Three hours, twenty hours, whatever, per day...the defect is real!" Please again watch this video:
Lil Diddies
I know our boobs are NOT about men or what they think of them!!! But stay with me here because I do have a point. There are many many men for whom small breasts are not only not a defect, but the PREFERRED size. This proves that small boobs, in and of themselves, are not a "defect" in objective terms. That judgment is SUBJECTIVE. You and I may consider them a defect, but it is not a "pure and simple fact" to all who wander the earth that small boobs are a defect.

I maybe should be ashamed to admit this but I'm not...I've done plenty of Internet research...enough to learn that there are many, many porn websites devoted to women with small boobs- some even specifically want flat only- because there are men who just don't like them any bigger than small! So although our boobs are about US and not about men, what this proves is that small boobs is not a "defect", or it would be so to everyone. It might be something WE DON'T WANT. (I have ALWAYS wanted big ones and always felt like I'd get them and it was just a matter of time. I'm still waiting!) But our not wanting smallies, or our finding larger ones more aesthetically pleasing to us, or our thinking we would be more confident or our life would be different, does not make our small ones a defect. It makes them something we have trouble dealing with, that's all. And that's BDD. (when it's an obsession, which by your posts, I can easily see that it is. It is for me too.)

The reason this is all so important is because I understand your concerns about "Is it really BDD when my defect is 'real'?" Yes, it's BDD, and the very fact that we think we have a defect because our breasts are small is actually proof that we are dealing with the Dysmorphia monster!

3.) I have a friend who is a shrink. (She calls herself a "psychiatrist".) She told me that I am ego-dystonic. She said it happens when someone's reality is not in line with their sense of self, either how they think they should be or how they feel that they actually are. This shrink friend always felt like she "should" be rich. But she's not. So she has constant issues with being ego-dystonic...not fitting her image of herself. And she said for me, it sounds like I'm ego-dystonic in terms of my boobs. I am not what I pictured that I'd be, or what I picture that I should be. And I can't make the reality fit my mind's image of myself because they are disjointed. She said that's why I am obsessed. My mind is trying to make the two fit together: my reality and my true self, and it's not working. She said being ego-dystonic is why I am in this hole, while other small-boobed women live happily. Unfortunately, she said the only way to fix such a situation is to bring things in line, either by changing the mind's-eye image, or by changing the reality to conform to that image. (e.g. BDD therapy/ otherwise alter our minds to deal with our reality, or surgery) I guess on some level I'd finally realized that those are the only two ways out of this, but it hurt to hear that. I want a third option! if you're like me, you keep waiting for 'something to happen' that fixes it somehow. I've even tried hypnotherapy!!!

I feel for you so because I'm right there with you. Sometimes I think I'm "over it" but then some trigger will set me off again.

I know my life would have been different if I'd had bigger ones, but I honestly feel that 99% of the reason for that would be that I'd have acted differently, made different choices, and allowed myself to live more. Knowing that doesn't free me.

[Aithinne]

I'm pretty sure he could tell what I was thinking and I think that made him not so happy with himself either for making me feel that way.

NO. YOU are making yourself feel this way. HE has nothing to do with it. Take the responsibility for your own negative thoughts and don't blame him for making you feel insecure. Ultimately, no one can MAKE you insecure. Think about this quote from Eleanor Roosevelt: "No one can make you feel inferior without your consent."

I definitely think I've had body dysmorphic disorder for many years due to my obsessing about this problem, but the main definition is worrying about a defect that is "slight or imagined" and I'm pretty sure my defect is real.

Your problem is in considering it a defect in the first place and then obsessing about it. THAT is what makes it BDD.

Whenever I've talked to a bf about this before they say "no its all in your head" but how can it be? Is it all in my head that I can't fill out a bra?? Is it all in my head that my chest never developed??

That you can't fill out a bra is genetic happenstance. That it affects you in such a crippling negative way really is "all in your head". Buttercups, you DON'T HAVE to live this way!!! And the solution is not to fix your body, it's to fix your destructive thought processes!

I mean bra sizes don't lie and maybe I would have BDD if I was a nice full B cup and felt this way- but at a AA arent I a little justified to think that something is missing?

No. You are not justified to think something is missing because nothing is missing but your self-esteem. Confidence is NOT dependent on what's written on your bra tag. You must separate the two.

Haha just got sooo off track but I guess my main point is yes I do wonder all the time how different my life would be with a decent set of breasts.

Repeat after me: "I have perfectly normal, perfectly wonderful and beautiful breasts. They have the amazing capability of providing nourishment for my future children that I can amazingly grow in my body. My body can work miracles!" BRAINWASH yourself with positive words as much as you destroy yourself with negative words.

Another thing to be insanely happy about- They are HEALTHY. I just found out a few weeks ago that one of my friends from college has VERY aggressive breast cancer and she's only a few months older than me at 24! She's already had a masectomy and can't even wait to heal from the surgery to start chemo, it's so aggressive. Trust me, when someone you know who is young and smart and kind of heart gets this disease, you love your own and are more grateful for life than ever. People many times cannot comprehend that breast cancer means DEATH in many cases. Be thankful for LIFE, buttercups. A life you're shortchanging yourself out of because of lies you spoon feed yourself!

I know it wouldn't take away all my problems, but I would just have the luxury of not being able to worry about how feminine I look and if my small barely A's are not enough to turn my bf on - even when he insists thats not the truth.

You'll probably be able to help your bf if you gain confidence. If you didn't turn him on, what is the point of being in a relationship? I'm sure no guy looks at a woman and thinks, "Wow, I'm so turned off by her, she has no sexual appeal to me whatsoever. I think I'll try to date her." YEAH! That makes A LOT of sense. And he would feel much less pressure to perform if he didn't have to worry about satisfying you AND filling the gaping holes in your confidence that you are blaming HIM for.

Somewhere in my sick mind I need an explanation and I don't so much as want him to say that he thinks my boobs are too small for him to get it up, but that I'm just not his type or something. I feel like maybe it's something he doesn't want to admit but that kind of confession would put things together so much better in my mind and then I could at least get angry- "you don't like small breasts? Oh yeah well F**k off!" -something like that!

If you don't stop this thinking now, this relationship and EVERY relationship in the future is DOOMED for failure because you feel so insecure and scapegoat the poor guy for your problems and think all his problems have to do with your breasts. Think about that. You are dooming yourself to a life of unhappiness and failed relationships, not because your breasts happen to be small, but because you cannot love your body and have the high level of self-esteem that successful relationships require.

[buttercups]

That is a great point strongirl. I don't know why whenever a problem like this happens I always take it like its about me being inadequate (mainly in the chest area). Even last night I went over his house and once again he was having "performance" issues and the idea popped back into my head that I had no breasts to arouse him and that was the problem. I tried my hardest to push it out but its so hard to back down once that thought is in there. I didn't bring it up this time but I'm pretty sure he could tell what I was thinking and I think that made him not so happy with himself either for making me feel that way.

Lightchested that's exactly how I feel- like what would happen if I had boobs- I don't even mean big boobs I just mean an A cup for chrissake! I'm not greedy I'm not asking for much just a little something so I can get out of this 10 year old body. If I had nice full A's or a small B I wonder if things would be different... When I was younger and in high school I used to tell myself that if I just stopped looking at my chest and obsessing then one day I would look down and they would have grown ( so silly). So I spent years being this kind of superstitious and forcing myself to not look down at my bare chest and guess what- no change. I guess I find it strange that I could just skip over this developmental step and be perfectly healthy. I also wonder what it must be like to be just a regular girl with average breasts and not have to worry about this ever. I'm sure I would have some other worry about my body, but for some reason that seems like it would be more of a normal concern. Like maybe I wouldn't like my thighs- but at least I have thighs to not like. It's like a body part is missing. I definitely think I've had body dysmorphic disorder for many years due to my obsessing about this problem, but the main definition is worrying about a defect that is "slight or imagined" and I'm pretty sure my defect is real. Whenever I've talked to a bf about this before they say "no its all in your head" but how can it be? Is it all in my head that I can't fill out a bra?? Is it all in my head that my chest never developed?? I mean bra sizes don't lie and maybe I would have BDD if I was a nice full B cup and felt this way- but at a AA arent I a little justified to think that something is missing? Haha just got sooo off track but I guess my main point is yes I do wonder all the time how different my life would be with a decent set of breasts. I know it wouldn't take away all my problems, but I would just have the luxury of not being able to worry about how feminine I look and if my small barely A's are not enough to turn my bf on - even when he insists thats not the truth. Somewhere in my sick mind I need an explanation and I don't so much as want him to say that he thinks my boobs are too small for him to get it up, but that I'm just not his type or something. I feel like maybe it's something he doesn't want to admit but that kind of confession would put things together so much better in my mind and then I could at least get angry- "you don't like small breasts? Oh yeah well F**k off!" -something like that!

[Aithinne]

"When I reacted from that insecure place, he had no room to be down, grumpy, un-sexual or angry without triggering me to have a self-esteem crash, which felt to him like he had to suppress his problems. That wasn't fair to him."

VERY good point strongirl... We should all think very long and hard on those words of wisdom. Surely no guy would want to be emotionally intimate with you if he felt like he couldn't express himself without opening up a can of worms that really has nothing to do with his problem.

[strongirl]

Buttercups, in the earlier years of our relationship my bf and I had fights where I reacted like that. Not so much thinking it was my tits per se but having the suspicion that he was picking a fight with me so we'd break up and he could be with someone younger, hotter, cuter, prettier, thinner, bustier...I have a whole laundry list of things that my "insecure self" thinks compare badly to other chicks. After voicing that to him a couple times, with his patience and excellent ability to communicate. he was finally able to get across to me that that viewpoint was really quite self-centered and immature on my part. After that I'd remind myself to really listen when he was upset and try to see it from his point of view and to tell myself "Everything is NOT about your looks, silly girl!" When I reacted from that insecure place, he had no room to be down, grumpy, un-sexual or angry without triggering me to have a self-esteem crash, which felt to him like he had to suppress his problems. That wasn't fair to him. Now we've gotten pretty good about letting conflicts really be what they're about.

Of course it's harder to do when you're drunk (been there, too). You'll get there. You're further along than I was at your age, by a long shot. Sending you positive energy and hoping this is just a minor bump in the road for you.