[olivarria]

Funk0039, I appreciate your input and I think you had some great suggestions, but I don't think showing him my thoughts would do the least bit of good. He knows that I feel like he treats me negatively, because we went over it many, many times during my teen years. We've gone to therapy......we've had numerous long discussions. He has definitely become a better father since he adopted me at age 4, but we've had a fair share of issues. My dad knows pretty much how I feel - another long (and honest) discussion won't change things. He knows I think he's mad at me all the time.....we will always have a strained relationship, I just have to face that. I talked to three therapists about it in the last few years. My last therapist told me point-blank - "Some people just don't like their children." .....I guess i shouldn't have brought up something I've already kind of dealt with....it's a dead-end situation. But sometimes it still hurts, you know? I don't think about it most of the time, except when i visit my dad or talk to him on the phone (rarely). But I can't change him, so there's nothing i can do about the situation but accept reality.

[funk0039]

I talked to my Mom and she said that he didn't want to bring it up because he thought it would upset me - i guess I misinterpreted him. Muffy I think it's true that he doesn't show feelings very much - he only shows anger, but rarely happiness or sadness. I used to think he was a sociopath when i was little - seriously, because he is so stoic, except when he's angry. Dolor, my dad has supported me over the years financially and as a parent, but I always feel he is doing it out of obligation. Sometimes I think he loves me.....most of the time. But I don't think he likes me. I feel like he is exasperated by everything I do - like all he finds are criticisms. I don't think he really likes most people. I especially annoy him I think, because we are so different from each other. We fought a lot when I was growing up. Sometimes i feel like I am walking on eggshells so i don't piss him off, but he always finds something anyway.

And Funk I think you are right on some level - but my dad just doesn't open up very often. i feel he's very hard to read.....but he doesn't seem very happy to me. He seems so angry at the whole world sometimes....nothing but complaints. He also came from a family who didn't show any emotion, so maybe that's why?

This might be risky, but I think you should show him the letter I just block quoted. Even if it makes him mad, at the very least you'll know what he really thinks, so you'll never have to sit in limbo, not knowing one way or another like you are now. Or you can just tell him verbally the contents of this letter. One of the key components of chronic depression(the serious stuff) is that there are issues inside yourself that you never faced. Anger turns into sadness, and sadness turns into depression if you don't face what's inside that's screwing you up. Even if your father isn't the sole reason why you are feeling terrible, at least if you told him how you feel, a part of it would go away.

I know that when I tried to tell my mother how I felt, even in a nonthreatening/nonblaming sort of way, she went REALLY defensive. She asked me if my therapist "put that in there". I tried to tell her no, that this was something that I never spoke to anyone about, but she didn't listen. It was as if she was holding her ears and shouting "la la la" so she couldn't hear the possibility that she might not have been perfect in her raising of me, since that's logically where my feelings would have came from, although I never said so.

I think my example is the worst of all possible outcomes, so your father might not be that way. Even if he doesn't respond well, at least you would have gotten that out of you. Isn't it natural when you stub your toe that you yell "Ow"? Same thing here, only you are saying that you feel bad because you think that your dad doesn't love you. He might even deny that, telling you that he really cares about your well being, who knows? If he's angry all the time(much like my little brother Justin) he is probably not mad at you specifically. I bet it would help him to redirect his anger towards the source if you told him you thought he was mad at you all the time.

I dunno, I don't have all the solutions nor do I know all your life details. I'm doing my best to help, using my experiences as a guide. So, think about what I wrote, just let it wander about in the back of your head, and let me know if you try it, and what happened if you did. I guess I just don't want anyone else to lose their family like I did. Nobody needs or deserves that. You can't know how precious a family is until you don't have one anymore, especially on the holidays.

You have my hopes with you, if that helps any.

[olivarria]

I talked to my Mom and she said that he didn't want to bring it up because he thought it would upset me - i guess I misinterpreted him. Muffy I think it's true that he doesn't show feelings very much - he only shows anger, but rarely happiness or sadness. I used to think he was a sociopath when i was little - seriously, because he is so stoic, except when he's angry. Dolor, my dad has supported me over the years financially and as a parent, but I always feel he is doing it out of obligation. Sometimes I think he loves me.....most of the time. But I don't think he likes me. I feel like he is exasperated by everything I do - like all he finds are criticisms. I don't think he really likes most people. I especially annoy him I think, because we are so different from eachother. We fought a lot when I was growing up. Sometimes i feel like I am walking on eggshells so i don't piss him off, but he always finds something anyway.

And Funk I think you are right on some level - but my dad just doesn't open up very often. i feel he's very hard to read.....but he doesn't seem very happy to me. He seems so angry at the whole world sometimes....nothing but complaints. He also came from a family who didn't show any emotion, so maybe that's why?

Back to studying - 1 exam down, 1 assignment down. 2 exams and two assigments to go before I'm caught up. Experimental psych is hard!

[persimmon_grrrl]

thanks for all of the supportive responses, busties.

muffy: yeah, i think that the decision will help me move more and feel more involved in what's going on with my life. i just wish i could figure out a good balance between the workaday and my own goals.

starpiste: congrats on making that empowering decision! i think that eventually i'll feel good about this decision. it was a job with benefits, and i felt really trapped there, but also kept it and ran with it out of necessity. i also feel i did well at my job. and thanks for that buoying quote.

stargazer: i'm feeling it difficult to sit with my decision and trust myself. i hope to come to peace with it and just know that it's okay, soon!

auralpoison: thanks for sharing that anecdote. i hope your sciatica is healed, or at least not flaring up. lately, i've been feeling like my shoulders are up to my ears all of the time. i think maybe a big art project will help get my life more moist. i need to create creative space.

[funk0039]

stargazer, I probably will never totally be completely okay with being alone.

funk, Its hard to shut everything off. I practice yoga and mediation just about every day. Usually writing helps too. I'm an artist but I can't function as one when I'm feeling really down, I just sit there in front of my paintings and cry.

olivarria, my biological Dad is like that on most occasions. I don't think my Dad is very good with feelings and expression of them. He is more about fixing cars and stuff that he can fix. When I told my parents that I had thyroid cancer a few years back it was as if I had just reported the weather. My Dad never even looked up from the paper! Is it possible he just has a hard time expressing his feelings? It can come off as not caring.

I know what you mean about not being ok with being alone. After a whole weekend of being alone I get depressed easily. It's even worse on the holidays.

When you have the urge to cry, don't fight it, just let it happen. Depression can't be repressed, but yeah you're right meditation helps to keep your emotions from getting too powerful. Do you get cable? The Soup and Daily Show really help me laugh, even a little. Could you paint your feelings?

Expressing emotions is a learned skill, so maybe the only way you can get your Dad to level with you is to directly state that it doesn't matter if he sucks at talking about feelings, just that he tries to talk?

[Muffy]

stargazer, I probably will never totally be completely okay with being alone. I do have those days when I have things I want to accomplish and know I need to do it minus company. When I'm busy I don't always notice. Its when I don't have anything to do.. or like Friday when I was just missing my friends. They always seem so busy with their lives that I feel left out. I called my best friends after posting and they actually were home! I hung out with them until about 1am, and felt 100%. On Saturday, I went to a family wedding which wasn't as horrific as I thought it would be, though I wish I would've had someone to ask to be my date. All and all, my weekend was the best I've had in months!

funk, Its hard to shut everything off. I practice yoga and mediation just about every day. Usually writing helps too. I'm an artist but I can't function as one when I'm feeling really down, I just sit there in front of my paintings and cry.

olivarria, my biological Dad is like that on most occasions. I don't think my Dad is very good with feelings and expression of them. He is more about fixing cars and stuff that he can fix. When I told my parents that I had thyroid cancer a few years back it was as if I had just reported the weather. My Dad never even looked up from the paper! Is it possible he just has a hard time expressing his feelings? It can come off as not caring.

[starpiste]

I've been through that therapy, it's called Dialectic Behavior Therapy, or DBT for short. It does work, but I went through group therapy as well as a private therapist. Do you have access to a DBT group? It's really great for getting you to change how you're thinking on a fundamental level, but it takes a lot of will so you really have to want it. I don't know what else you'd like to know about it, but you can ask your therapist or somebody on this thread.

I don't think I was asking any questions about this book or approach at all. My therapist has given me lots of information to groups if I decide it's something I want to do. We have a great mood disorder center in my city so I'm pretty well linked to that sort of thing.

persimmon, I just recently quit my "stable" second job, and it was definitely scary to do, and I'm still worried about paying my bills next month, but I feel really relieved that I finally did it. It's allowing me to put way more energy into things I want to do, and build myself in an industry I actually want to be involved in. good luck. Rhonda Britten says something like "fear is what your brain does to keep you from moving forward".

[dolor]

Olivarria,

It's very possible that your Dad did not talk to you about your crisis because he knows (in some part of his mind) that he is partly responsible for your suicidal thoughts. Because he did not support ("want") you-- in the first place. So his original incompetence as a parent is now aggravated by his guilt. (Guilt that he may not recognize.) This will make it that much more difficult for him to be open with you.

Hang in there! But take care of yourself-- in the first place. Don't be too surprised if your father turns out to be essentially not there for you. Look for support.. where you find it.

[funk0039]

I was disappointed by my visit with my dad because he did not seem to care the least bit what I was going through - he didn't even mention it to me, even though my mom told him I went to the ER for suicidal thoughts, so he knows. My whole life I've felt kind of unwanted by my dad (I'm adopted by him, my om is biological), and I've never felt like he likes me or wants to spend time with me, so I shouldn't be surprised. I don't expect him to coddle me, but a "Are you doing better?" would have been nice. Sheesh. He just sits in front of the TV, and says stuff like, "Don't use the same dishtowel or we'll get sick too!" All he says are criticisms and requests and mumbling "Hi" and "Fine."

Is it possible he doesn't know what to say to you? I don't know your dad, but my stepdad was very quiet with me too. Maybe, if you could talk with him alone, you could tell him that you feel unwanted by him. If he is like you think he is, he won't respond, but if he does love you he might be startled into telling you the truth. My stepfather was always afraid of countering my mother, because I think he was always struggling to help her be happy, as he knew how much she worked to support the family(he has problems with his back so it's hard for him to do a lot of things).

It's just an idea.

[olivarria]

Hi everyone - i only have time for a quick post because I am about to start a study/test-taking marathon for the next three days. Then I can post more in depth details about how I'm doing and try to give some support to you all. I visited my parents this weekend and it went okay. The first night I was crying a lot, but the next day i felt better. I have the flu and I'm losing my voice and sneezing, but I don't so depressed now - I'm looking forward to the future and my goals, which feels great. I feel like I'm waking up from a stupor and now I'm like, "Oh shit, I have get it together. There are things to do!" But i feel full of possibilities right now, instead of stagnant and empty like last week. Life is full of color now - cool, right?

I was disappointed by my visit with my dad because he did not seem to care the least bit what I was going through - he didn't even mention it to me, even though my mom told him I went to the ER for suicidal thoughts, so he knows. My whole life I've felt kind of unwanted by my dad (I'm adopted by him, my mom is biological), and I've never felt like he likes me or wants to spend time with me, so I shouldn't be surprised. I don't expect him to coddle me, but a "Are you doing better?" would have been nice. Sheesh. He just sits in front of the TV, and says stuff like, "Don't use the same dishtowel or we'll get sick too!" All he says are criticisms and requests and mumbling "Hi" and "Fine."

Also, I've decided to stay at my current school, but in January I hope to move to a studio apartment in the city rather then living in a dorm community with 18-19 year olds. (I'm almost 25!) I need grown-ups. I hope this will help. I will have to post more later. I wish good thoughts for everyone.

I will respond to your post later Candycane I'm sorry - I'm majorly behind in schoolwork!

(((Everyone)))

[candycane_girl]

olivarria, I know it's a bit late but I just wanted to let you know that I'm glad you're alright. I know how strong the urge to cut can be and it's something that's just so hard to deal with. I have also had thoughts of suicide at times (and one attempt a loooong time ago) even though I knew that I wouldn't actually go through with it. I was told that when I cut my wrists years ago that I didn't actually want to die but that it was a cry for help and I think that's true in a lot of cases. Also for me it was the feeling that I didnt want to die but that I needed a break from everything.

Right now, I'm doing pretty well. I finally saw my doctor and she agreed with me that I can go off my meds but of course I'm weaning myself off of them. It makes me so happy to know that eventually I won't have to take a pill every morning just to feel normal. But I'm going to take it really slow and make sure that my doc is always aware of how I'm doing.

I'm sending out positive vibes to all depressed busties. I hope you're all doing okay.

[auralpoison]

Persimmon, I can tell you that I hung onto my last job for way too long. Security is great & all, but I hated the job with a passion by the end. My BODY turned on me because I was so unhappy. This sounds so dumb, but it's true. About a *year* before I quit, I developed a whopping case of sciatica. Vicious, mean sciatica. It actually started *at* work. It made it difficult for me to walk to work & to sit in my cube. Once I quit, a week later I was fine. LITERALLY. It was gone. That was a case of my body kicking my mind in the ass. I'm uber glad that I finally wised up & listened.

And Funk, your posts were mere *minutes* apart. And you didn't "receive" them, you viewed them. I don't think condensing them into one cohesive post would be that hard. I do it all the time.

[funk0039]

funk, can you limit your response to 1 post? thanks. also, using a yo yo to distract yourself? dude, i know you are not serious. and it would be great if you could share about yourself in this thread instead of just being an advice giver.
[/quote]

I have used a yo yo, and it works wonders for my state of mind. I'm quite serious. You have to concentrate just enough to keep it going, and the gentle repetitive motion clears my mind.

As for "just being an advice giver" when I see someone who's hurting I do all I can to help, even though that person might be a stranger or I might not be able to help very much but I do what little I can. That's a big part of who and what I am. I've found that instead of doing something destructive when I feel like crap, I do something positive and it helps both me and the individuals I try to help sometimes feel better. Finally, because of my experiences elsewhere, I've been limiting myself to this thread, and also limiting myself to responding rarely if at all. This coincidentally limits the amount of material I can be attacked over by some on this forum.

As for limiting myself to just one post, I received those posts at different times, and thus responded at different times. I didn't know they were going to show up one after another at the time I posted. It wasn't intentional, sorry about that.

In the future, if anyone has criticism for me, please just pm. I don't like subjecting anyone to arguments that won't help on this thread. Depression is serious business, IMHO.

[stargazer]

pesimmon, are you asking if leaving your job is irrational? it sounds like something you've been considering for a long time. it also sounds like you are focused on taking care of yourself which can be scary and a risk in itself. what you did does not seem rash at all. i made a similar decision for myself about 2 years ago. i'm glad i did it. i hope you can feel good about your decision too eventually.

starpiste, wow. it looks like you've done alot of work on your own to deal with your depression. good for you.


olivarria, how are you doing?

muffy, oh maude. i know what you mean about being alone. as much as i convinced myself that i am comfortable with being alone...i wasn't comfortable with it at all. i'm spending my time right now trying to be ok with enjoying my time alone. i hope you did something you could enjoy friday night.


funk, can you limit your response to 1 post? thanks. also, using a yo yo to distract yourself? dude, i know you are not serious. and it would be great if you could share about yourself in this thread instead of just being an advice giver.

[funk0039]

Its Friday night, I have no plans and I'm going to try not to get upset if everyone is too busy to hang out with me.

I hope everyone has a good weekend.

When the pain inside gets too bad, even in the middle of the night, I go for a long walk where there is a lot of people I can be near, or maybe just enjoying walking in the park. Is there something you could do to distract yourself, like a yo yo or something?

[funk0039]

"Mindful way through depression" is what I'm reading now. I'm not far in enough to give my opinions, but my last therapist recommended it. The first 20 pages are depressing because all that's discussed is how easy and common relapse is, but once I got past that part it was better. It also comes with a CD in the back with mindfulness exercises.

I've been through that therapy, it's called Dialectic Behavior Therapy, or DBT for short. It does work, but I went through group therapy as well as a private therapist. Do you have access to a DBT group? It's really great for getting you to change how you're thinking on a fundamental level, but it takes a lot of will so you really have to want it. I don't know what else you'd like to know about it, but you can ask your therapist or somebody on this thread.

[funk0039]

happy friday everyone,

i think i made a big mistake. i am feeling really stuck and unmotivated in my life right now, and today gave a week's notice at my job. prior, earlier in september, i'd given a month's notice.

now, i feel like i really need to go inside and focus on what's going on with myself.

is this wrong? rash? absolutely bonkers?

Do you have a way to support yourself for a while, like living with your parents or depending on a spouse? It's not a bad idea, it's just that you may not be able to keep working on yourself exclusively. How long have you been depressed? Do you have anybody that you trust their judgment? Part of being depressed means that your ability to think clearly is hampered. That was the hardest thing for me to admit to myself, that I was making poor decisions which were making things worse. In the end, you're going to have to find someone you trust, like your doctor or sister or whatever, and ask their opinion.

[Muffy]

persimmon_grrrl, If you feel that you can't work at your job and focus on yourself than you did the right thing. No one deserved to be depressed and miserable.

stargazer, I think I may check out some of those books as well.

I started a new second job, I am exhausted, my sleep problems haven't been solved and my friends are are busy with their lives so even though I had the night off last night I ended up just being alone. Its Friday night, I have no plans and I'm going to try not to get upset if everyone is too busy to hang out with me.

I hope everyone has a good weekend.

[persimmon_grrrl]

happy friday everyone,

i think i made a big mistake. i am feeling really stuck and unmotivated in my life right now, and today gave a week's notice at my job. prior, earlier in september, i'd given a month's notice.

now, i feel like i really need to go inside and focus on what's going on with myself.

is this wrong? rash? absolutely bonkers?

[olivarria]

Thank you both for the great recommendations; I'll give them a try.