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> Take It Outside, the thread for disagreements & derailments
roseviolet
post Sep 7 2008, 02:30 PM
Post #1


Pacifism kicks ass!
***
Posts: 3,064


Looks like the old version of this thread was accidentally deleted, so it was suggested that it be revived. Well, here it is!
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roseviolet
post Oct 10 2008, 08:36 AM
Post #2


Pacifism kicks ass!
***
Posts: 3,064


Funk, I think the others would agree that I'm one of the "sweeties" around here. I don't get riled up or angry in the Lounge very often. I try to remain calm. I'm not saying the others are wrong for reacting differently - definitely not! - but that's just the way I react to things. I like to step back from situations, take a breather, give people the benefit of the doubt, etc.

All that being said ...
I think you should leave this site. Not only for the benefit of others, but for your own benefit, as well.

QUOTE(funk0039 @ Oct 9 2008, 06:14 PM) *
I asked a female friend of mine a few minutes ago, and she said that most men are pretty selfish, so when women encounter a man who's helpful they immediately try to defend themselves because they figure it's a set-up. She said that I should leave this forum, because there are women who are really negative and who won't want anyone around who contradicts their views. That last statement wasn't meant to antagonize!


I don't feel that way. I don't feel that most men are selfish & should always be received with suspicion. I don't even feel that way about the occasional guy who joins this forum (I actually met my husband here in the Bust Lounge, so I obviously am not offended by a male presence on this forum). The problem here is not that you might contradict our views. Your views aren't really the issue here. The problem is your tone. The problem is the way you present yourself and the way you speak to others.

Since you brought up broad gender stereotypes, I'll mention another. It is believed that when most men hear a woman express a problem, their immediate reaction is to try to fix the problem. They cannot understand that a person may be talking about their feelings simply because they wish to receive sympathy. Solutions can be nice as long as they're worded as suggestions, but when a woman is crying and heart-broken, that usually isn't the best time to give her a list of things she must do to fix her life. I've seen you do this, Funk. Over and over again.

Stereotypes aside, my issues with your posts began long before I learned that you are male. I picked up a decidedly condescending tone. I felt as though you thought your audience was simple-minded & uneducated on the very basics of human behavior. I saw you spouting out generalities rather than addressing individuals & their unique feelings & unique situations. I did not read sympathy in your posts. Rather, I sensed superiority. I sensed that you felt that the way you lived your life and how you handled your issues was the only way for anyone to tackle these problems. You worded your statements not as helpful suggestions, but as demands. Orders.

Look at this recent post (Oct. 8th) to see what I'm talking about: Click
Here is a person in pain. The very first thing you say to this person is an extremely harsh statement. Then you spout out orders. Perhaps you meant them to sound like helpful suggestions, but they do not come across that way. You make it sound as if you think you are the be-all-end-all expert on exactly what every person should do with their lives. And seeing as, by your own admission, you are still mentally unwell, I think that's a very unhealthy position for you to take - unhealthy for yourself and for others.

Since you seem to appreciate suggestions, I hope you'll forgive me for offering you a couple. First, I think you should add a little sympathy to your communications with others. If you'd perhaps told the individual that you were sorry to hear they were feeling so badly & told them that they are not alone, that would help a lot. Sympathy & support is HUGE ... especially in the depression thread. Secondly, perhaps you should try asking questions. Instead of ordering an individual to "Go to the wisest person you know of either gender," you could say "Who have you spoken to about this? When I was in a similar situation, I found the wisest person I could think of & I talked to them about it. It helped me a lot. Maybe it could help you, too." Do you see the difference - the VERY important difference - between these two responses? If you don't, then I think you need more help than any of us can offer.

The point isn't about being "right" or "wrong". There may be sound information in your posts, but the way you come across is undermining any good information you may have to offer. Indeed, it can be very damaging. I understand that you don't mean to come across that way, but you do ... at least in print. The negative reaction you're receiving is, unfortunately, deserved. It's all bound to be hurtful for you. That can't be good for you, seeing as you're still battling your own depression. So for your own health and for the benefit of others, I think it might be best if you moved along.
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funk0039
post Oct 10 2008, 04:20 PM
Post #3


BUSTie
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Posts: 60
From: St Cloud MN, USA


QUOTE(roseviolet @ Oct 10 2008, 08:36 AM) *
Funk, I think the others would agree that I'm one of the "sweeties" around here. I don't get riled up or angry in the Lounge very often. I try to remain calm. I'm not saying the others are wrong for reacting differently - definitely not! - but that's just the way I react to things. I like to step back from situations, take a breather, give people the benefit of the doubt, etc.

All that being said ...
I think you should leave this site. Not only for the benefit of others, but for your own benefit, as well.
I don't feel that way. I don't feel that most men are selfish & should always be received with suspicion. I don't even feel that way about the occasional guy who joins this forum (I actually met my husband here in the Bust Lounge, so I obviously am not offended by a male presence on this forum). The problem here is not that you might contradict our views. Your views aren't really the issue here. The problem is your tone. The problem is the way you present yourself and the way you speak to others.

Since you brought up broad gender stereotypes, I'll mention another. It is believed that when most men hear a woman express a problem, their immediate reaction is to try to fix the problem. They cannot understand that a person may be talking about their feelings simply because they wish to receive sympathy. Solutions can be nice as long as they're worded as suggestions, but when a woman is crying and heart-broken, that usually isn't the best time to give her a list of things she must do to fix her life. I've seen you do this, Funk. Over and over again.

Stereotypes aside, my issues with your posts began long before I learned that you are male. I picked up a decidedly condescending tone. I felt as though you thought your audience was simple-minded & uneducated on the very basics of human behavior. I saw you spouting out generalities rather than addressing individuals & their unique feelings & unique situations. I did not read sympathy in your posts. Rather, I sensed superiority. I sensed that you felt that the way you lived your life and how you handled your issues was the only way for anyone to tackle these problems. You worded your statements not as helpful suggestions, but as demands. Orders.

Look at this recent post (Oct. 8th) to see what I'm talking about: Click
Here is a person in pain. The very first thing you say to this person is an extremely harsh statement. Then you spout out orders. Perhaps you meant them to sound like helpful suggestions, but they do not come across that way. You make it sound as if you think you are the be-all-end-all expert on exactly what every person should do with their lives. And seeing as, by your own admission, you are still mentally unwell, I think that's a very unhealthy position for you to take - unhealthy for yourself and for others.

Since you seem to appreciate suggestions, I hope you'll forgive me for offering you a couple. First, I think you should add a little sympathy to your communications with others. If you'd perhaps told the individual that you were sorry to hear they were feeling so badly & told them that they are not alone, that would help a lot. Sympathy & support is HUGE ... especially in the depression thread. Secondly, perhaps you should try asking questions. Instead of ordering an individual to "Go to the wisest person you know of either gender," you could say "Who have you spoken to about this? When I was in a similar situation, I found the wisest person I could think of & I talked to them about it. It helped me a lot. Maybe it could help you, too." Do you see the difference - the VERY important difference - between these two responses? If you don't, then I think you need more help than any of us can offer.

The point isn't about being "right" or "wrong". There may be sound information in your posts, but the way you come across is undermining any good information you may have to offer. Indeed, it can be very damaging. I understand that you don't mean to come across that way, but you do ... at least in print. The negative reaction you're receiving is, unfortunately, deserved. It's all bound to be hurtful for you. That can't be good for you, seeing as you're still battling your own depression. So for your own health and for the benefit of others, I think it might be best if you moved along.


Ok, I want to make sure I'm getting this right. You're saying that I was implying that I was the perfect expert by the way I was posting? For that, I am sorry, that was NOT what I meant! The whole point of language is to get your point across, and I've been screwing it up. I never intended to be harsh! Usually when I express sympathy/support, I'm right there in person, and I do something like give them a hug or try to make them physically comfortable, anything to help. Often I just hold them close, male or female, and tell them they can cry all they want it's ok. That wasn't coming across, those little actions and my tone of voice. Sheesh, I'm starting to get it, I think. You can give me as many suggestions you like, believe me I'll listen to anyone who isn't crude, hostile etc and has something to say! No, I'm not implying that I want to stay(in fact I don't know how to delete my profile here, how do I do that?) but I do want to learn something if I can.


--------------------
"Know thyself." Socrates
"This above all to thineownself be true." William Shakepeare
"Do unto others as you would have them do unto you." the Bible
These 3 laws govern who I am, whether or not you like it.
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Posts in this topic
roseviolet   Take It Outside   Sep 7 2008, 02:30 PM
thenewrussia   Does anyone have Facebook? Does anyone play the a...   Sep 17 2008, 04:00 PM
stargazer   russia, this is the wrong thread to post your ques...   Sep 17 2008, 04:11 PM
pollystyrene   First of all, don't single me out as the one s...   Sep 23 2008, 04:30 PM
girltrouble   dood. i can't believe that you interrupted tha...   Sep 23 2008, 04:52 PM
girlygirlgag   Alrighty. GT, I think you are great, but you need...   Oct 1 2008, 11:27 AM
girltrouble   so if i reply then it's just another hissy fi...   Oct 7 2008, 12:35 PM
erinjane   so if i reply then it's just another hissy fit...   Oct 7 2008, 12:43 PM
girltrouble   honestly, i had no issue with you, ej, i took you...   Oct 7 2008, 01:20 PM
bunnyb   I think bunnyb made a good point that she feels li...   Oct 7 2008, 02:17 PM
erinjane   I'm sorry I made you feel that way, erinjane. ...   Oct 7 2008, 02:47 PM
girltrouble   thank you bunny, that's awful sweet of you. i...   Oct 7 2008, 02:39 PM
vixen_within   while we are on the topic, pepper, what have you...   Oct 8 2008, 09:46 AM
girltrouble   i disagree, vixen. my question was about how thin...   Oct 8 2008, 10:17 AM
kittenb   I was trying to be offensive. I don't even t...   Oct 9 2008, 09:52 AM
pollystyrene   I'm going to break the "one you'll ne...   Oct 9 2008, 10:19 AM
bunnyb   Why whatever do you mean, polly? I dislocated my ...   Oct 9 2008, 10:24 AM
pollystyrene   LOL, bunny. Kitten, that was definitely a health...   Oct 9 2008, 10:26 AM
culturehandy   I read the last line in one of his posts, I just w...   Oct 9 2008, 11:32 AM
candycane_girl   Oh lordy, I don't know what else to say except...   Oct 9 2008, 11:47 AM
auralpoison   He's found his niche here. He's dug his t...   Oct 9 2008, 12:06 PM
gradgal   I agree with all of you ladies! I have been...   Oct 9 2008, 12:19 PM
thirtiesgirl   He's a 'savior guy,' and it's hard...   Oct 9 2008, 01:30 PM
auralpoison   I am salivating as I type this. He's gonna be...   Oct 9 2008, 05:05 PM
funk0039   I had no idea so many of you thought me destructiv...   Oct 9 2008, 05:12 PM
funk0039   If you all collectively believe me beyond salvage,...   Oct 9 2008, 05:14 PM
kittenb   You've heard our opinions. Leave.   Oct 9 2008, 05:17 PM
auralpoison   Again with the martyr schtick. Get off the cross,...   Oct 9 2008, 05:20 PM
gradgal   I think that you hit the nail on the head and poin...   Oct 9 2008, 05:39 PM
funk0039   I think that you hit the nail on the head and poin...   Oct 9 2008, 06:14 PM
auralpoison   Gradgal, *long slow clap* You hit the point right...   Oct 9 2008, 06:04 PM
hellotampon   Yeah, go eat a bag of dicks. :lol: I really hope...   Oct 9 2008, 07:22 PM
auralpoison   We don't think you're setting us up. We t...   Oct 9 2008, 06:49 PM
auralpoison   Make yourself a t shirt & you'll never for...   Oct 9 2008, 07:38 PM
girltrouble   wait.... did i miss a slow clap for a bag of dicks...   Oct 9 2008, 08:18 PM
thirtiesgirl   In connection with the bag of dicks theme, I'l...   Oct 9 2008, 08:29 PM
pollystyrene   In the Cameron Frye voice, auralpoison, you're...   Oct 9 2008, 10:22 PM
stargazer   I asked a female friend of mine a few minutes ago,...   Oct 9 2008, 10:34 PM
girltrouble   ok, i guess i can say it without reservation: my f...   Oct 10 2008, 12:12 AM
auralpoison   "When Cameron was in Egypt's land . . . l...   Oct 10 2008, 01:26 AM
bunnyb   There are women & men here that I'd get on...   Oct 10 2008, 04:42 AM
culturehandy   I don't try and defenf myself when someone of ...   Oct 10 2008, 09:34 AM
funk0039   dude, some of your posts come across as rude. We h...   Oct 10 2008, 04:08 PM
auralpoison   :wub: Count me as drunk on the love. Dude, if RV...   Oct 10 2008, 09:51 AM
mornington   Funk, that is *exactly* what rose is saying - that...   Oct 10 2008, 07:07 PM
pollystyrene   We don't care, don't have the time or desi...   Oct 10 2008, 07:25 PM
girltrouble   um, mornington, right now, i am so super jealous o...   Oct 10 2008, 07:27 PM
StarryStacey   Oh my gosh. I think I hacked the fuckers account. ...   Oct 10 2008, 11:04 PM
StarryStacey   Oh my gosh. I think I hacked the fuckers account. ...   Oct 10 2008, 11:24 PM
funk0039   I've been doing some thinking. First, I'd...   Oct 11 2008, 08:52 AM
ModSquad   Hold it right there! The ModSquad wants to le...   Oct 11 2008, 08:56 AM
culturehandy   yes starrystacey sent me a message informing me of...   Oct 11 2008, 08:59 AM
crinoline   slow clap for funk's amazing Miss Cleo imperso...   Oct 11 2008, 09:41 AM
culturehandy   Ahhhh there he goes again with the condescending t...   Oct 11 2008, 10:06 AM
faerietails   HAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA!!! okay, i had t...   Oct 11 2008, 10:24 AM
culturehandy   I wonder where he got his PhD from.   Oct 11 2008, 10:28 AM
roseviolet   Funk, I tried to help you earlier. I was willing t...   Oct 11 2008, 11:11 AM
girltrouble   pot meet kettle? i'm going to hazard a guess...   Oct 11 2008, 11:21 AM
thirtiesgirl   Oh, fuck off, funk and go the hell away. You...   Oct 11 2008, 11:39 AM
pollystyrene   Sorry, I'm too busy laughing my ass off at fun...   Oct 11 2008, 11:48 AM
kittenb   You know, I've never been a part of running so...   Oct 11 2008, 12:00 PM
hellotampon   I like how he was constantly inviting all his ...   Oct 11 2008, 12:16 PM
culturehandy   Bwaaahahahahaha Kitten. I shoulda come wif a pit...   Oct 11 2008, 02:33 PM
auralpoison   Oh. My. God. I really needed that. I did. I d...   Oct 12 2008, 08:39 AM
thirtiesgirl   Ok, mouse, continuing our argument from the Hallow...   Nov 2 2008, 03:19 AM
mouse   ok, first off, this took place outside the store, ...   Nov 2 2008, 05:26 AM
thirtiesgirl   i don't want to sound holier than thou and i r...   Nov 2 2008, 12:30 PM
sybarite   I may regret this, and I don't mean to be redu...   Nov 2 2008, 09:33 AM
mouse   thank you syb, that explains it nicely. thirties...   Nov 2 2008, 02:54 PM
roseviolet   the point is, i crossed a bridge, treated someone ...   Nov 2 2008, 03:27 PM
thirtiesgirl   I agree it sucks, what has happened with Latino fa...   Nov 2 2008, 04:33 PM
mouse   well i guess we'll have to agree to disagree.   Nov 2 2008, 05:32 PM
zoya   what I believe mouse did was make herself "hu...   Nov 2 2008, 08:10 PM
roseviolet   From the Sufferin' Suffragettes thread ... [q...   Nov 8 2008, 12:03 PM
girltrouble   i think this is the first time i've been in th...   Nov 8 2008, 01:16 PM
anarch   I admire your condemnation of the concept of ...   Nov 9 2008, 01:49 AM
culturehandy   Nohope your comments about Islam being gibberish a...   Nov 10 2008, 06:24 PM
girlygirlgag   NoHope is the worst kind fo troll..... He just say...   Nov 10 2008, 06:37 PM
culturehandy   GGG, you're right. I should no better, but thi...   Nov 10 2008, 07:36 PM
auralpoison   If it ain't black & white (Or Red.) politi...   Nov 10 2008, 07:49 PM
culturehandy   If no hope is really that miserable, why doesn...   Nov 10 2008, 08:27 PM
auralpoison   You pick a name like "NoHope", you know ...   Nov 10 2008, 09:10 PM
culturehandy   AP, I always love your posts. They give me a panty...   Nov 10 2008, 09:15 PM
auralpoison   This poppeded into my head: "No heroes, no l...   Nov 10 2008, 09:20 PM
culturehandy   Awww, AP :wub: I so want to be a part of the prol...   Nov 10 2008, 09:23 PM
auralpoison   I'm petite bougie as a motherfucker. Exploit ...   Nov 10 2008, 09:35 PM
culturehandy   Oh exploit me exploit me!   Nov 10 2008, 09:54 PM
girltrouble   in case you didn't know, ap, if you prefer all...   Nov 10 2008, 10:02 PM
auralpoison   Naw, there is something so effervescent about ...   Nov 10 2008, 10:08 PM
mouse   nohope--islam isn't any more a "sacred co...   Nov 10 2008, 10:16 PM
nohope   nohope--islam isn't any more a "sacred co...   Nov 11 2008, 01:52 PM
auralpoison   *A long slow clap for Mouse* I have a lot of rega...   Nov 10 2008, 11:09 PM
culturehandy   I also studied religion in University, I took a ve...   Nov 11 2008, 08:15 AM
nohope   So, NoHope, why don't you get a fcuking clue...   Nov 11 2008, 01:45 PM
girltrouble   in nohope's defense, he isn't a troll. he...   Nov 11 2008, 09:11 AM
nohope   i don't know where his recent anti-choice I a...   Nov 11 2008, 02:03 PM
pollystyrene   I think he's never been disrespectful until no...   Nov 11 2008, 09:22 AM
missladyj   I think nohope is a total douche . I don't kno...   Nov 11 2008, 10:00 AM
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