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chachaheels
Sounds great--now for your mom....

I hope the two of you can turn the weekend into a drinks and gab fest, and jump the whole weight/size issue completely (or at least get it out of the way so you can talk about other things). I am wishing wishing wishing you come out of the weekend feeling great.

Enjoy!
misspissed
golly, my mom is my worst enemy when it comes to weight loss.
much of it has to do with her own struggles with weight gain, and she definitely projects a lot of her anger and frustration on me. but it is still so hard to hear the backhanded crap about how big my arse is, and how i need to exercise more.

we had an argument the other night about how i "should be" 120 lbs, because that's what the weight charts say. i tried explaining that when i was down to 130, i was boney as shit and getting any thinner than that would be most unattractive on my body.
like talking to a wall.

in fact, i am boycotting even talking to my mom for a while because she is so fucking insulting and insensitive about weight.

\end off topic rant.
sixelacat
Go 'way, fool. Nobody likes you in real life, nobody likes you here. Shoo.


RE mothers: I have to keep reminding myself that even though she's talking to me, she's never really talking about me, you know?
sassygrrl
Fucking trolls....

Well, my mother was a total bitch. It was all about the fact that I had gained weight, due to the medication, and the fact that I didn't exercise, and the fact that I have no relationship. Jesbus Christ! All shit went down this afternoon before my plane ride. And the whole weekend, she was eyeing everything I put in my mouth. She expects me to be a perfect 150-160 pounds, and totally forgetting the fact that I'm on two meds that fuck with my metabolism.....

Grrr....

And my father was on me about sleeping too much. It couldn't be possibility that I had two seizures last week??

Fuck. I guess I can't win. And, they wonder why I only see them once every 6 months or so?


Thank you for all the busty love thought. I did try to drug her with many bottles of red wine, but it didn't seem to help. mad.gif

Happy healthy vibes for everyone else.

End rant.
misspissed
(((sassy))
so sorry your parents were asshats.
you'd think that they'd appreciate the fact that you visited them, and take the opportunity to make nice.

man, i had the worst night tonight regarding self-esteem/weight issues. it is the wrong thread for me to get into it, but i just want to say, there are some major major assholes in this world.
chachaheels
Oh, Sassy, I'm sorry to hear that things went the way they did.

I don't know if this is of any help, but what sixelacat said about "people talking to you, but not talking about you" is absolutely true. If you see things from this perspective, you can't take what your parents say personally, and you should never take it to heart.

Maybe the best thing you could do is give yourself permission not to spend time with them, if that is what you want. Make plans to spend holidays with good friends, for example, instead of with your parents--it's just a suggestion, but it's one that worked for me in the past. I'd say your obligations have been met: no one would blame you if you chose to spend your time having fun with other people instead of doing the required visit with the parents for a while.
raisingirl
Feh. Parents. I just don't tell them anything anymore.

I am mightily contemplating working on Thanksgiving. I only see the good things: holiday pay, which I really need; and no opportunity to pig out for an entire day. Plus the fact that I'm veg and the holiday meal centers around a dead bird isn't exactly my idea of fun. Thought about having a veg feast chez moi, but I'm not so hot on the idea for whatever reasons. My place is too small.

Went to the gym this morning. The day is so much better when I hit the gym first thing when I wake up. I feel like a broken record saying this all the time.
chachaheels
Oooh, I dunno. I remember having an impromtu "not gonna spend thanksgiving with my parents this year" dinner for me and all my friends who had, for whatever reason, decided not to go home to their own families. There were a couple of us who were vegetarians, one who was vegan, and the rest of the group were meateaters. I remember making a huge, huge, turkey (cause there whad to be one!), stuffing, and all the traditional foods--plus about 16 other dishes that were completely vegetarian and vegan. I had about 25 people show up, all together, and my apartment was not big--I had a tiny kitchen that fit me and one other person so closely we both got snippy with each other...but I had a loft area that was big enough for everyone to stand, sit on the floor, eat a la buffet style.

I only had one leftover: the turkey. I had just enough to make one sandwich for M.ChaCha, and one for my roommate, who was a big carnivore. The vegetarian stuff was devoured...I don't even think I had any cranberry dressing left.

But the whole thing was stress free, even though I cooked for what felt like ever, making sweet potato pancakes and biscuits, soups, potatoes, wild rice dishes, polentas, pastas, roasted vegetables, salads, a cheesecake and a couple of pies.

Why? Cause I ate whatever the hell I wanted without anyone's commentary, I ate as much as I wanted (which wasn't that much, cause I was hosting!) and I talked about whatever I wanted, laughed when I wanted to laugh, and no one made critical remarks or offensive noises like my parents might have done.
The day flew by and my friends and I really had a wonderful time, talking until the early hours of the morning.

Made me rearrange my whole thinking on what family really means. I can't stand ugly family holiday behaviour, and I won't subject myself to it anymore. If I feel it's going to happen, I simply don't go anymore. Who wants to spend time in misery with people, when there are so many ways to celebrate and enjoy other people's company?
thereshegoes
i agree with those who have spoken--- thanksgiving without the fam is way better. i eat whatever i want and yet somehow i eat less when i don't have people commenting on every bite. funny, after my mother announced to the entire table i was on weight watchers one mother's day, those big holiday meals sound less and less appealing.

i am sorry for any woman (or man) who has to go through that kind of thing. it's hard not to take it personally, even if it's more about them than you.

anyhow, i did want to chime in and ask what people thought about walking as exercise. does it really give you an aerobic kick, or am i just fooling myself?
sybarite
Thereshegoes, I walk about 3 miles a day, just getting from A to B as I don't drive. I think it depends on how you walk. Because I walk a lot I make a conscious effort to walk well. I'm a fast walker anyway, but I also try to hold my head up and pull in my stomach to get the most from the walk.

I also find walking, even on a mundane errand, to be therapeutic. If I'm stressed or unhappy it allows me to process whatever is going on, or to calm down by the time I get to work if the stress is work-related.

Additionally walking is supposed to be better for exercising your joints than running, with less risk of injury. You'll sleep better at night too, IME.

/pro-walking PSA... I'm not on commission, honest!
thereshegoes
thanks sybarite----good tip about the stomach pull.
sassygrrl
Definately contemplating not spending holidays with family. Both of them apologized, but it was still hard. I know they care about me, but I really don't want to do the holidays with them this year. Think I'll just hang out with some close friends. I did this a few years back, and really loved it. It was a bunch of friends who had fucked up dysfunctional families, and we drank a lot that night. It was a blast!


Thanks for all the busty love!



Also wanted to chime in with walking. I walk about a mile a day for work (being I don't drive). I also find it extremely therapeutic as well.... Especially, if I'm having a bad day.....
raisingirl
Yeah, for clarification, I have done the friends-only Thanksgiving dinners. They have been really fun. I just think I would rather work, especially knowing the $ would go to fund my trip next summer.

This isn't a knock against anyone, so don't take it that way, but I seriously feel like I'm constantly repeating myself here, always talking in circles. Does anyone else feel this way? I should make a master post and then post it every four months, at least it would save my hands. cool.gif Yes, walking is excellent. Any kind of movement, for that matter, is excellent if you're starting from zero (not saying that you are, Thereshegoes, just making a general statement here). But walking is always excellent.
misspissed
hahah, raisin, yeah...i feel like i talk in circles regarding weight loss/becoming healthy, because there are only so many solutions to this problem, ya know?

i mean, we all know we should eat moderate portions of healthier food and exercise more. but sometimes good things need repeating.

i think i want to have a solo thanksgiving this year. would that be pathetic or what? just me, some TV Land reruns, and a lean cuisine turkey dinner.
sybarite
I think the repetition may also come from that fact that people are differently motivated so come in looking for tips at different times. Reading about everyone else's enthusiasm motivates me somewhat, especially after a summer spent guzzling wine and eating cheese and not doing tae bo. sad.gif

I have found a new place that does tae bo classes though so I'm excited. I liked my old gym more, but their tae bo instructor has left so no joy there. I can't talk myself into a spin class or similar I'm afraid; they just don't seem like much fun. I need to bribe myself with an interesting class to get around my inherent laziness, and with autumn coming I need a strategy or two.
sixelacat
syb's right, that why I keep coming back to this thread, for the reminders and enthusiasm of others! biggrin.gif

misspissed, some of my favorite Thanksgivings have been just me, parades, and John O'Hurley presenting dogs. I love to cook, and did a small roast duck with trimmings a couple of years ago, just for myself. Best, most restful holiday in ages. And that's what Thanksgiving's supposed to be about, to me anyway. I don't think we thank ourselves enough (okay, that sounds narcissistic, but you know what I mean, right?)

raisin, I was veg for *counts on fingers* I think 6, maybe 7 years, and your post reminded me of the family thanksgiving I actually went to after much haranguing by my folks (who knew I was veg). Every dish had meat in it. Greanbeans with bacon, mashed potatoes with same, turkey bits in the stuffing, everything. They never put meat in the sides when I was growing up! Passive-aggressive much? After that I've never felt bad doing exactly what I want on holidays....

And everyone keep posting about the morning gym visits! I'm working up to choosing a gym close to my job, which would mean going before work. I normally don't like mornings, but I know from past experience that my days will go better if I can establish that routine....I just need to buy a few more alarm clocks (I can sleep right through the 3 I already have dry.gif )
maddy29
I got up at 6:45 this morning and was on the weight machines at 8:00. Did some weights and 25 minutes on the treadmill, showered, and got to work right on time. YAY ME! The thing is, I have to go to bed at 9:30 to be able to wake up at 6:30. THat sorta sucks. I mean, I like going to bed, but that's pretty early.

But, I feel really good, am in a better mood today, feel more relaxed, and am just really proud that i did it. now i just have to keep doing it! i want to get so used to it that it's just a routine i hardly have to think about. but something tells me i'll always be trying to motivate myself....

i started a live journal community for a few of my friends that are trying to eat healthy and exercise, so we can post our progress or problems. i feel like i need all the help i can get. Also, it's a great way to chart my progress.
chachaheels
Oh, sixelacat, I was vegetarian for 13 years and every.single.family.meal. I ever attended was the exact same deal you write about: meat was put in food that was never cooked with meat in the history I shared with my parents, ever! Like, suddenly, they made dessert with meat or things like lard--foods I KNOW my mother never made that way in her life! Fuck, did not eating meat ever threaten them.

I remember being so naive as to actually give them answers when they'd ask me questions about being vegetarian "all of a sudden" (which they felt compelled to do at every one of our shared meals, up to and including year 13!). It got to the point where, if I'd actually accept an invitation, I would just bring my own food (which, let's just check out the significance of that in the context of "sharing food being symbolic of peace"). Some family members would then like what I brought, which created trouble...it was always some kind of disaster around that table. When I started to feel like the food, the conversation, and all the interaction taking place around me was calculated to either piss me off or silence me, I knew I was free never to attend again. I'd make quick visits during holidays if I felt like it, but I never ate with them anymore. Oh, yes, they whined; and oh, yes, I just said, "Sorry, I can't" and that was that.

I eat meat and fish now, and I still don't want to have meals with them unless certain conditions are met (we are not eating homecooked, or I cook the food, or I make the reservations at a restaurant which will look after everybody so we never cross that bullshit bridge at the dinner table now). Can you tell I'm still angry about this
stuff? A little? It's because I know it really wasn't about the food at all...that was just the excuse they used to play out their issues with me.

And then people wonder why it is that food and nutrition is such a loaded, emotion driven topic for so many of us, and why our relationships to food and to our bodies are so often self-destructive!

Ahem...well, maybe that was a little "off topic", but I felt like I had to get that off my chest so I can move on with what I'm supposed to be doing.
_octinoxate
Oh gosh, I hate to hear that so many other peoples' families pull that nonsense on them too. My mom, and at times my sister, have made those critical, hurtful comments to me at family events and I know how hard it is to remember that it's all about them and their own issues... but it's the truth! Once my mom lost some weight and also got to a happier place in her life (remarriage, etc. etc.), the critical attitude magically ceased. So there may be hope yet, ladies... and in the mean time, I totally second the notion that you have every right to sit out on events that will make you feel like crap.

SO! I am here to OFFICIALLY COMMIT to getting back to healthier habits. Today my acupuncturist/ nurse practitioner (who I now go to instead of my old doctors) told me that my knee injury will take 6 months to a year to fully heal. I believe her. The "8 weeks" that the docs said, in spring, turned out to be bullshit. So, now that I'm accepting the fact that I'm going to be significantly discapacitated for the (somewhat) long haul, I'm also deciding to cope with this better.

Until now, I've been resigning myself to gaining weight and getting out of shape, figuring that once I can be active again I can lose it and get fit and healthy again. (I've also been figuring that I'm heartbroken and will continue to be for a while, so I don't give a shit how my body looks because nobody will be seeing it in various states of undress... and, I've been feeling generally depressed and discouraged and in the mood to say "Fuck it!" to healthy decisions because they haven't gotten me where I want to be so far... anyone relate?)

But now, things are gonna change. I don't want to be totally sedentary for a fucking year, or have all the lovely effects that come with such a lifestyle: reduced energy, less restful sleep, higher blood pressure, weight gain, worse mood, and probably a whole host of other negative effects that slip my mind at the moment. The point is, the body is meant to MOVE. So even if half of my body is incapable of moving, I'm going to start using the other half more, and treating the whole thing better. I resolve to:

1. start using the hand cycle (what do they really call it?) at the gym at least 10 minutes, 3 times a week. (To increase later.)
2. keep weight lifting, at least 3 times a week.
3. stretch my legs every day.
4. do back stabilization exercises/ abs at least 3 times a week.
5. Get up and stretch and/or briefly meditate before breakfast/shower.
6. eat consciously, which means:
a. When I want to eat not out of hunger but for other reasons, I'll at least stop and take 3 deep conscious breaths before just grabbing snacks and compulsively eating. (Who knows, maybe that will actually stop me!)
b. I'll pay closer attention to my sugar intake. Realistically I won't cut out sugary products, but I'll try to have only one sweet thing per day.
c. I might switch to a matcha tea + 1 carb breakfast, instead of the random and excessive munching I do when I wake up.
d. I will eat at least two fresh/whole foods every day. (Buy more fruit!)
e. I will eat flax seed (for my knee inflammation) at least twice a week.
f. I will not consume any alcohol, at all. (This may sound extreme, but my consumption is already really minimal.)
g. I will decide which vitamins, supplements, and herbs I'm actually going to take and then be more regular about taking them.
7. Maybe most importantly, I will not beat myself up or fall into anorectic eating patterns or give up on my healthy resolutions if I mess up every once in a while. (Or all the time at first!)

Anyone want to join me in making at least one little tiny (but specific and doable) plan? Come on!

WHOA! Re-reading that, it's a lot to commit to. I think I'll take it bit by bit, starting with using the hand cycle 3x/wk and breathing/stretching first thing in the morning.
chachaheels
Hey! That's good to hear and I want to wholeheartedly support you on your renewed commitments. I don't think there's too much there, as long as you are realistic about getting what you want done. Don't sweat it! It sounds to me like you'll be getting all the exercise you need, some motivation to put extra attention and time for yourself into your life, plus some good all around care from people who tell you things up front and honestly, so you can make the plans you need to make to get better. It doesn't sound at all like you'll be "out of commission" for the next little while: just approaching things slightly differently. You may come out a lot further ahead than you thought! And I hope that's the case.

Plus, your post's been inspiring. There are a few things I need to make sure I do for myself that I'm reminded about, just reading your plans. I love it when people turn what could be a set-back into an opportunity, and I need to be reminded to do the same when that stuff happens to me.

raisingirl
Octi (I've always wondered, what does your name mean?), that's an ambitious plan and you're smart to do it bit by bit, not everything at once.

I really want to find a new doctor, but my only reason for doing so is because I hate going to the hospital on the few occasions when I do go (because that's where the doc's office is).

I didn't go to the gym this morning because I have a couple of hours of housecleaning to do.

I have nothing else to offer until I compose my master post which I shall repost every four months. I might be kidding. wink.gif
_octinoxate
Thanks for the support, chacha! And I'm glad my post was inpsiring. I am definitely trying to turn this setback into an opportunity, as you put it. In fact, last night I sat down and made up a list of things that I can learn/want to learn/ perhaps am supposed to learn from this whole experience. It's 2 pages long so far, and I'll still be adding to it... the latest one I came up with is PATIENCE!

I'm doing well so far: after I posted last night I went and hand-cycled and lifted, and this morning I already stretched/breathed and had a healthy breakfast (oatmeal with flax, bananas, and brown sugar, plus a peach. Yum.).

Raisin, I'm all about nurse practitioners right now. I love mine, and from what I hear (from chacha and others), there is a general pattern in which nurse practitioners spend more time with patients, work with patients instead of working on them, and are cheaper. You might want to look into it in your search for a new medical provider.

And for the record, I totally think housecleaning is a legit substitute for the gym.

My name, BTW, is basically meaningless. In truth, it's an active ingredient in sunblock. The only reason it's my user name is that when I first found BUST years ago, I wanted to post and created an account in haste, thinking I would use it that one time and never again... for a username, I just grabbed the nearest object that had text on it, which happened to be my sunblock! Little did I know that four years later...
chachaheels
Yay! Patience is something it seems we all have to learn the hard way. But it is the supreme way to avoid getting your ass kicked hard, so the education process will be worth it.

Octi, you mentioned something in your last post about feeling like you needed to munch all the time in the morning. Has that been a problem for long?
sassygrrl
Yay! I'm drinking more water. I know this is a little step in my mind, but a big one for me b/c I can't stand the taste of the stuff.

Also, trying to eat more veggies. I have had salad for lunch the last two days at work.... smile.gif Going to also try eating a mid morning snack before lunch (because I always skip breakfast!).

My mother apologized in an email about her rude as fuck behavior, and also told me that she herself is trying to lose weight. Wonder if the fight was really about her unhappiness with her figure??

Hmmm.....

All groovy support to my favorite busties!!

_octinoxate
Hey chacha, yeah, for quite a while I've had this tendency to want to keep eating/snacking even after breakfast is officially over. Sometimes it happens with other meals as well, but I'd say most often with breakfast. It's not really that I'm still hungry, but just that I'm still craving stuff, usually carbs (sometimes sweets, sometimes just whole wheat bread or something like that). My eating patterns can get weird because I used to have an eating disorder, so I usually chalk it up to that... but are you thinking there's something physiological potentially going on with this one?

Sassy, I'm 100% willing to bet that your mom's behavior was about her own body and dissatisfaction with it. I wonder if she was maybe even looking to you to "model" some better attitude... on some level she wanted to find out how to combat those negative comments and feelings about when they're leveled at *her*, about her own body... ? And so she wanted to see how you deal with it? (not suggesting that she was doing any of this to you consciously, of course.) Great that she apologized, at any rate!
crazyoldcatlady
octinoxate, that's a fab username story, btw.

and to touch on what you said, about the "nothing's gonna change so why bother"...i am so in that mode right now. any time i've lost weight, it's not because i was actively trying to. anytime i do work out consistently and eat healthier, i just don't lose.

so basically, i'm just waiting to get an intestinal parasite to help move things along wink.gif
mandolyn
bwah! so stealing that one, catlady!

*tap tap tap*

mandi's baby steps:
- a doctor's appt on monday. including bloodwork and thyroid check. because it's been too damn long, and with my age and family history, i should know better.
- two seemingly sensible weight-loss/management books. i'm so not a "self-help" reader. but i'm desperate for ... something. willpower. inner strength. something to help me.
- trying to at least be mindful of the food choices i make.

yeah. that's about it. i'm not in the mode either. forget that it's been months on end of mode-less-ness.

/end broken record.
chachaheels
Well, Octi, yes I do believe there is something physiological going on.

This is a big thing to keep in mind: ALL cravings stem from a bona fide, real physiological need.

This is something that happens to a lot of people who cut out calories in an effort to lose weight--there is a difficulty getting the blood sugar levels to stay balanced. If you have any kind of issue with this balance, or if there is any hypoglycemic tendency (and with a history of anorexia there, I would expect this to be the case) then you're craving carbs and sugary foods, and just foods in particular, because your blood sugar level is low.

I would suggest adding 2 things to your breakfast: a serving of protein is absolutely necessary
and a serving of fat (a tablespoon of coconut oil, or a serving of butter. You can either cook your protein with it or put it on your carbohydrate serving, if you're eating some kind of bread). Coconut oil works for a lot of people cause they can take it in their tea or spread it on toast--but it's such a thyroid supportive fat and it's loaded with great nutrients that help you to feel nourished (plus its so helpful for joint pain too).

Limit the carb intake so that you aren't forcing your pancreas to flood your blood with insulin; too much sugar in the diet forces this to happen, and when the sugar in the blood is dealt with and there's still insulin in the system, then you'll start craving more sugar to try and rebalance things....and that sets up a cycle where you have to produce more and more insulin (and crave more and more carbs).

And the outcome from that can only be weight gain.

The protein helps to stabilize this and it keeps your insulin receptors from becoming resistant to the insulin you produce. The fat helps you to maximize the nutrients you actually absorb from your food and creats satiety--so you do not feel like you need to snack on anything else until lunch.

Do you eat meat products? Eggs? Cheese? Adding an egg, or a serving of fresh, sweet cheese (like a fresh ricotta cheese) can really make a huge difference. Some people like to eat a couple of rashers of bacon, or kippers, or that kind of thing (whatever you might like if you eat meat).
If you're a vegetarian or a vegan, you can make a breakfast cereal for yourself out of higher protein, whole grains, and add things like almonds, pecans, sunflower seeds or pepitas to the mixture for extra protein. Let me know--I have a great recipe for a breakfast cereal that has to soak first, but it tastes amazingly good. It's good if you're not a vegetarian or vegan either--it would give you more variety in the diet.

Either way--stable blood sugar and fewer cravings all around.
_octinoxate
Thanks for the info, chacha. I'm not currently cutting calories, but it may be that I have hypoglycemic tendencies in general, or maybe it's just b/c my blood sugar is low from not having eating for 12 hours by the time breakfast time rolls around..? I'll try your suggestions about adding (vegetarian) protein and fat. It's counter-intuitive in a way to eat the opposite of what I'm craving, but it does make sense in the end.

I thought coconut oil was to be avoided b/c of high saturated fat content... but is that coconut *milk*, perhaps?

I'd love your breakfast cereal recipe...
chachaheels
Rancid coconut oil (like any rancid fat) is to be avoided, because it is rancid and ultimately harmful to the body, not because it is a saturated fat. Saturated fats are absolutely vital to good health--but they have to be fresh and pure. Use an extra virgin, cold pressed coconut oil. It's so essential, and I don't know how anyone would lose weight, stimulate their metabolism (instead of encouraging it to shut down) and assimilate their nutrients from vegetables and proteins without it. I know this sounds contrary to what a lot of the conventional thinking dictates, but there is so much extensive, long term (as in 60 years' worth) research that supports its use as a beneficial and necessary fat it can't be ignored.

The cereal recipe:

Gail's Budwig Cream Meusli

5c. raw, regular rolled oat flakes
1/2c. sunflower seeds, ground (in a coffee grinder reserved for this purpose!)
1/2c. sesame seeds, ground
1/2c. flax seeds, ground
1/2c. soy lecithin granules (purchased from a store which kept them in a refrigerator)
1/2c. almonds or pumpkin seeds, ground in coffee grinder

combine ingredients in a large bowl. Store in a zip-lock bag in your freezer (the oil in ground seeds and nuts goes rancid very quickly and it must be kept cold).

You can use this mixture to prepare one serving of the "Budwig Cream"
1. Measure 1/3c. of above mixture into a cereal bowl. Add the juice from 1/2 a lemon and then enough filtered water or milk or almond milk or soy milk to dampen the mixture. let sit for 7 hours at room temperature in order to neutralize the phytic acid (this is the ingredient in all grains which keeps you from fully utilizing the nutrients in the grain--it ends up acting as an anti-nutrient).

Note: all grains contain phytic acid in the bran. Untreated phytic acid combines with calcium, magnesium, phosphorus, iron, and zinc in the intestine and blocks their absorption. Soaking also neutralizes enzyme inhibitors. You need these minerals--especially the calcium--if you want to lose weight.

2. Into a food precessor, add
1 chopped apple
1/2 sliced banana
1 tb. fresh flax oil (stored in your freezer)
the soaked cereal/lemon juice/milk mixture you've made

Whirl in the food processor until smooth and creamy, transfer back into your cereal bowl, and enjoy!

Optional Ingredients:
1/2 tsp. calcium ascorbate (about 3000 mg. vitamin C)
1/2 tsp. ground ginger or cinnamon
1 tsp vanilla flavouring
1 tsp kelp (for iodine and minerals)
1 tsp spirulina (which will make the cream turn bright green)
1/2 tsp. liquid evening primrose oil

****my addition: here's where I'd put in the coconut oil!****

This is from Udo Erasmus' Fats that Heal, Fats that Kill book, which has some good suggestions (but is truly not the definitive book on fats...anyway, this tastes good whether you make it into a "creamy" cereal or not. Enjoy.

I've just found a recipe for a really good breakfast porridge, too--which can be made with oats or grains that people who can't eat wheats or glutens can eat. I'll post it if you want it...but it does get mixed with yogurt so if you're avoiding animal foods you may pass on it. Still: porridge is a fabulous vehicle for maple syrup, or dates, butter (if you're me!) and other good, rich stuff.
flanker_ji
Wow, that sounds like a great recipie, cha cha - does the lemon juice keep the milk from going sour when left sitting out?

As a weight-loss challenged individual, I'm going to have to look into coconut oil. Thanks cha cha, oh fount of knoweldge smile.gif

Octi, thanks for your inspriational post. The steps I'm taking are:

1. Start incorporating at least one more workout day into my week, and add weight lifting on days I don't have a class.
2. Take the new information about what I need to include and exclude from my diet to lower my triglycerides, which I've recently learned are quite high.
chachaheels
The lemon juice actually kind of "sours" the milk--like when you make buttermilk or sour cream. This is part of the process of lacto-fermentation that removes the phytic acid from your grains. The cereal has a kind of muesli taste--like yogurt mixed with fresh fruit and the fresh, whole grain.

If the lemon juice isn't to your taste, you can use the liquid that accumulates at the top of yogurt--that's very much the same kind of thing, and it is just as effective. This kind of soaking method also works for beans as well as grains. Soaking dried beans with a little filtered water and this liquid (or lemon juice) also eliminates phytates, gets rid of the enzyme inhibitors in the dried beans that allow you to properly digest them...and really gets rid of the "gas" problem most people have with beans.

All I have to say on that is, it's quite amazing how much less food you feel you need when you actually absorb the nutrients from what you're eating! Weight gain is very much a sign of deficiency, not overindulgence.

ETA Octi, I know you're not trying to lose weight but I know you are also concerned that a decline in mobility will mean you will find yourself gaining weight. I don't think it will happen though...and that's the concern I'm addressing when I post about watching for weight gain.
_octinoxate
Ooh, this talk of "souring" milk with lemon juice reminds me of a great recipe I just found for a simple mock-sour-cream dipping sauce: just mix up some plain yogurt, some lime juice, a bit of red pepper (flakes, ground, paste, whatever), some dill or thyme, and black pepper... and voila! A tasty accompaniment for savory dishes (I had it with potato/onion pancakes) that you can seriously make in one minute flat. Healthy, too. (Had to stick that on at the end to make this post not TOO off topic for the thread! smile.gif )
chachaheels
Oh my gah, I love "real" dips. You know, the kind you make yourself that taste so good because there's no strange chemical compound pseudo flavouring crap in it. I usually make a vat of stuff like that and then I apply it to all and sundry. It's like I MUST have that particular taste on many things for at least a little while before I can move on.

If I made that yogurt dip, I'd marinate stuff in it, eat it for lunch with fresh veggies or fresh bread, dress salads with it, drop it in soup...
I think my laziness actually knows no bounds, it even supercedes the food obsession I can get into; especially if I can get away with "less work, more yummy yogurt dip". Potato and onion pancakes...yearn!

Today I've been trying to scout out sources of pure, undrugged and unhormoned organ meats for my cat, who is very old and suffering from chronic kidney failure. I've managed to get him to pass some stones, so he's not in acute pain any more; but he's definitely, slowly, winding down and he needs really rich meat so he gets so many of the nutrients he's losing. I can't believe how hard that stuff is to find, even where I am (and I'm in an area surrounded by farmers of all kinds). I feel like all the gourmet "cooking" I've been doing lately centres around how I'm gonna feed my cat his necessaries. It's exhausting and I'm totally on his schedule now (up at 4am to get him out of the house so he can relieve himself; constantly at work on course material I have to finish in 10 days--very lonely work I'm up till all hours trying to finish! Really, posting here has saved my mind. In case you've all been wondering why the heck my posts are so long, and I'm always here! It really helps to periodically put my mind on something other than what's going on here.

Anywho, I'm going to get past this crazy computer work and:

Absolutely walk more. The autumn season is coming and I want to experience it outside. So I'm going to be out for at least an hour or more of walking every day. Whatever the weather.

All I need from you guys is the occasional, gentle, kick in the butt to remind me that I said that.







_octinoxate
chacha, want the recipe for those pancakes? BTW: rereading, I realized I made a typo... they're actually broccoli-onion pancakes. Even yummier, huh!

Gosh, I'm sorry to hear about your kitty cat. He's definitely in good hands with you though.
sassygrrl
Keep the recipes coming ya gals! They sound amazing.

Had a shit day at work, so totally not giving a shit about my diet this weekend. I almost got fired, so of course I go automatically for good chinese takeout and ice cream.

My mother is being a little nicer.

Oh, and I took a walk after work today!

_octinoxate
Broccoli Pancakes!

Ingredients:

-1 large head *steamed* broccoli (I use most of the stalk, but you can leave it out if you wish), finely chopped
-1/3 c. chopped onion
-approx. 1 tsp. chili paste or powder
-1 large garlic clove, finely chopped
-1/4 c. olive oil
-2/3 c. whole wheat flour
-1/8 tsp. dill (or whatever other spice you have around that smells nice)
-1 pinch salt
-1 egg
-1/4 c. milk

Just mix all those bad boys together and grill 'em up in a pan with a bit of olive oil or butter, about 1 minute per side. These are real tough to mess up... you can sub ingredients, make real rough estimates on measurements, etc. Eat with the dip posted below! Enjoy!

One more thing: for us lazy people (hi chacha darling!), this recipe is awesome b/c you can make a huge batch of it to keep in tupperware in the fridge, but only grill up as much as you want to eat at any one time... it always feels like you're eating fresh home cooking even though after you make that initial batch, it takes about 3 minutes to prep each time you eat. no microwaves required.

Also: I bet you could sub in other stuff than broccoli: potatoes, cauliflower, sweet potatoes, corn... whatever's in season (or about to go bad in the fridge).
chachaheels
Thanks, Octi...I hope my kitty is in good hands with me. I feel exceedingly guilty for not being able to pull him back into full health. I was around when he was born--and he'd been through this problem more than 10 years ago (I had no idea about animal health at all then, so he ended up getting a completely avoidable and brutal surgery...me and M. ChaCha are still feeling totally guilty about that). But now I know he's actually dying, and I am not ready to accept it yet. A couple of days ago I found a ridiculous Cat Tent, complete with ears and whiskers, at IKEA. I hemmed and hawed and bought it for him, because I thought he should have an insanely ridiculous little tent to hide in and rest in while he hangs around outside (his favourite thing). When M.ChaCha saw it, he ribbed me about but I said, "well, I don't know how much longer we will have him..." and that was it, we were both sobbing.

So the tent is there and the cat is, ironically but very much true to his nature, avoiding it. I catch him eyeing it quizzically on occasion, looking like he's going to shake his head and think to himself about what the hell I might have been thinking.
sassygrrl
((to chachaheels and her kitty))

Thanks for the pancake recipe octi!

Nothing really to report today, except trying to drink more water at home. :rolleyes:


End of broken record.
chachaheels
Sassy, baby, what broken record? I think drinking water--and drinking more water....is one of those things you need to be disciplined about, so if you're doing that, you're doing it. Rolling eyes are just not fair!

Can't we all think of some ways to make this physical work look, feel, and be more decadent? Then we'll feel like we've indulged, rather than sacrificed; but the workout's been accomplished anyway.

My mechanic (he's not my mechanic, but he owns the body shop and gas station close to my house so I see him all the time) is one of those Lance Armstrong type cyclists who's marathon raced everywhere. He's been asking me to come out and ride with him for three years now, with a group of cyclists who all ride through one of the most hilly *%#@!!! parks in the world. " Yeah", I always say to him, "sure, I'll get my bike and come right over!" cause it should be a breeze keeping up with him. And so much fun: me with all the compliments of my mostly sedentary life (including a bike from my childhood), and them with their toned and fortified thigh and calf muscles, rippling biceps, and 22 geared state of the art mountain bikes.

Lately, he's been suggesting that I join the badminton league in town--they play twice a week and it's really fun and it's a good work out. I'm going to be teaching on one of the nights, but the other: I'm gonna do it. I've been saying no, no, no, to all the invitations--but racquet sports are really fun and I think I'll have a great time. He's even scoped out a racquet sale (he was all excited to tell me about where to find the deals) so I've gone out to take a look. I'm looking forward to it!

sassygrrl
I just feel like sometimes I come in here and sound like a broken record. I didn't mean any harm by it.

Oh hey, lost two pounds.

chachaheels
***not scolding, just encouraging***

2 pounds! Yay!
_octinoxate
(Sassy, I actually thought it was funny! Hey, at least you're keeping at it even when you feel uninspired.)

Chacha, your cereal sounds awesome. I'm probably won't end up making it though, b/c I don't have a coffee grinder or a food processor... and in general it's so much easier to stumble out of bed and boil water for simple oatmeal (with some flax and random fruit thrown in).

Chacha, how is the kitty?
jemisoutrageous
I want a kitty tent! (Poor little guy.)
ChaCha, I have been eating a ton of soy lately but keep reading shit like this:

http://www.soyonlineservice.co.nz/03summary.htm

As our residential nutritional expert, do you have any opinions on this?
sassygrrl
WTF? Is soy bad for us now? Shit, it's like Woody Allen said: "Sun is bad for you. Everything our parents said was good is bad. Sun, milk, red meat... college. "

I'm glad I lost two pounds, but probably gained it back with the movie popcorn I ate today. Although, I just nibbled a bit on my date's small bag. So, that was just a little snack. I just had a diet coke. And had some black bean cakes for dinner, so it was a good meal.

Chacha, how is kitty?

Oh, drinking this new diet drink (well new to me at least) called Diet Canfield's Chocolate Fudge. It's like I'm cheating, but I'm not. No fat or carbs, and it really tastes like fudge. smile.gif

chachaheels
You guys are so fabulous...thank you for asking about my shmoo. He's doing better today: he actually broke into a run at one point (haven't seen that in a few days!) and he's hunggggrrrryyyy!!! His painful urinations have become much less frequent, but I do notice he's still producing quite a large volume, which, really does indicate his kidneys are still not 100% as he continues to dehydrate. He is talkative, however (he's always been quite a vocal cat) and affectionate. But I have noticed with his illness that he's incredibly sensitive to everything, even "too much" touch, or walking on surfaces that aren't smooth. M.ChaCha has been writing a piece of music for one of his commissions this weekend and my kitty's been wandering in to keep him company...so he is slowly becoming more curious about his nutty kitty tent while he visits with my husband. He's not in pain and he seems to be okay for much of the time. I feel like that's more than I can ask for at this point, and I know a vet will only want to put him down...which I will not allow.

Octi, that cereal's good even if you don't grind it up but just chop up the ingredients roughly, using a knife. All you have to do is set it up to soak before going to bed, and in the morning it will take less than a minute to cook up. The one thing which makes me a little nuts is that soy lecithin ingredient...but I recognize that it can be left out if you feel you don't want it (I always leave it out). There is a great deal of protein in the cereal as it is and if you wish to add more you can add other good grains that you love, like kamut or quinoa. I do hope you try it out, but I do have a side that, shall we say, favours the leisurely aspects of living a great deal more. So I totally feel you on that.

Jem, I'm sorry to say this, but I've been telling my patients about the dangers of soy for many, many years now. It really has to be organic, non-GMO, and fermented in the way it has been fermented for thousands of years if it is to be of any benefit to you (so, only pure, organic, non GMO miso and tamari is OK by me...as is tofu that is properly prepared like the ancients prepared it). Everything else: avoid, avoid, avoid.

It's a heavily processed foodstuff, most of it GMO, all of it treated with MSG (or used to make MSG), food colourings...things we weren't meant to eat. Add to that the fact that the Chinese--who invented tofu all those years ago--always ate it along with fish and meat, and you'll see how problematic it is. And it is in everything, or almost everything we eat that is processed or in some way prepared and packaged. Including things like orange juice, baby foods, breads, spice mixes, low fat milk or milk products--anywhere you see "hydrolyzed protein", MSG, "spices", "natural flavour", or "aroma"...it's a soy based hydrolyzed protein food. Labeling laws protect manufacturers from having to list it as an ingredient in everything if they meet certain conditions: but if you know how food is actually processed, you know it's in everything you could imagine. That freaks me out--if you suffer from any kind of thyroid illness, or have any kind of sensitivity to legumes of any kind, you'd have almost no soy free food out there unless you grew and prepared all your food yourself. All the points made on that website regarding phytates, trypsin, thyroid effects and endocrine effects of all kinds is true, unfortunately. There are so many alternatives you can use instead of soy if you really want to avoid animal foods (which I can understand, but still want to encourage you to use some animal foods, like butter and eggs), I would be happy to suggest some great alternatives which won't affect you negatively. It means you have to do a little more work cause the foods require your efforts for preparation, but they'll taste so much better and you'll be so much more nourished as a payoff.

Years ago I was a vegetarian and I ate quite a lot of soy products because I wanted to avoid milk products. When I became a vegetarian, I weighed 122 lbs and was 5'9" tall. Over the course of the 13 years that I stayed away from meats and fish and a lot of milk foods, I gained about 80 pounds: I had no energy, very painful joints and even bone pains, dry hair and brittle nails, skin that healed very slowly for things like minor cuts, and a variety of symptoms indicating endocrine disruption and hypothyroidism. I had no idea at the time that soy could be a big part of the problem, but it certainly was!

Sassy, Woody's complaints are justified: our parent's were actually right...about sun, meat, milk( with conditions***) but not college.
pepper
second the no-good-for-you-soy thing. even though we still eat it a bit, tofu and where ever it sneaks into pre-made foods (like Everywhere).

what about tempeh chacha? it's fermented like crazy and it is SO yummy too. hard to prepare though so it's not tempting to eat a lot of it.

~((kitty))~
hope your guy feels better and better.
chachaheels
I think the tempeh is one of those ancient foods, that is fermented/soaked/etc. My one issue with something like that is the raw material--is the soy used to produce that made with the actual heirloom legume or is it some kind of recently applied-for-licensed-frankenfood that we have no history eating anywhere on the planet? Is it organic or is it loaded with the organophosphates and chemical fertilizers they pump into the demineralized ground to grow this stuff in, that we'll just concentrate in our own systems? It bugs me that soy is such a profit-at-any-cost crop that our health is being destroyed by it, so even the good stuff is something you've got to double check. If it checks out, though, enjoy it.

thanks for the good wishes, pepper!
raisingirl
Oooooh, I do believe that Trader Joe's tofu is organic. I'm going to check when I go there this week. I don't eat tofu weekly or anything even though I AM veg, but it is a concern nevertheless.

I love dairy and eggs. Heh.

I made a vegetable soup tonight, just threw some stuff into a pot and voila, that's lunch for a few days. Also added chick peas and lentils.

I'm thinking it's time to see a nutritionist. I saw one several years ago, but it's time to go back again. Intellectually I know what to do, but I think I need a refresher and just general guidance for my situation of being a fat vegetarian who wants to be less fat. It was eye-opening to learn what a real serving of x, y, and z was.

How about that, a non-broken record post from me!
jemisoutrageous
I was afraid you were going to say that, ChaCha. dry.gif Thank you so much for the information.

I do eat meat, dairy, and fish, I am just trying to lose wieght and eat healthier all around (I have lost 30 lbs. since April) so I was using low-fat, alledgedly good-for-you-tofu as a meat substitute. It makes me so angry that soy is being touted as a wonder food and it's really jamming everyone up!

What should I be eating? ohmy.gif
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