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spot-on
Hi All
I am almost 3 weeks post-surgery. As I don't want to post pics online I am going to email anyone that wants to see before/after pics so far. If you want to see them please PM me your emails address.

Pics are in a bikini, and annonymous (headless) but show the progression so far. I also have other pics without bikini I would be willing to share to a few regulars smile.gif
karategrrl
QUOTE(strongirl @ Dec 27 2010, 05:07 PM) *
"Hey - I can't find the cat - can you check under your boobs?"

LOL!!!!!!'
OMG, love it!!!
Yes, do try and just talk to her, but I have to add--be prepared for her to be unresponsive. I'd say something along the lines of, "The things you say are hurtful and come across as immature and make you sound really insecure,etc. Please stop." Buuut, she may not get it unless you stoop to her level. (I've learned that, unfortunately, you have to learn someone's language and use it with them b/c they don't "speak" niceness and reason.

If she acts like an ass if you approach with kindness, then I'd whip out the "impending sag" and "can't find the cat" and such comments--often. Until she gets SICK of it. That may be the only way she gets the message. Unfortunately.
insideout
Thanks for the advice! I've never been one for confrontation so we'll see if I can grow a pair. Of balls. I never realized how that statement could be ambiguous when I say it, lol.
wondermist
QUOTE(insideout @ Dec 27 2010, 11:41 PM) *
Thanks for the advice! I've never been one for confrontation so we'll see if I can grow a pair. Of balls. I never realized how that statement could be ambiguous when I say it, lol.


Teehee, that made me giggle. Ambiguity's not so bad sometimes! Good luck. I hope everything turns out all right.
KeraBear
"the girl I get along with the best has a nasty habit of putting me down." The girl that you get a long with BEST? Geeeeez, get out of there! LOL Seriously, though. I guess I agree with my fellow busties that you should try to talk to her about it. I mean if you get along with her the best than she has to care about you on SOME level, shouldn't she? But yeah, it sounds like she has some major self esteem issues. At my school, there are girls who give me a lot of crap about my small boobs, but i think there are some jealously issues with them because i am short and petite and pretty thin. Do you think maybe she might be jealous? Sooo yeah, i more side with Stronggirl in that I wouldn't want to stoop to her level, but at the same time, maybe she should get a taste of her own medicine if she doesn't get the message? I dunno. But do let us know what happens when you finally "grow a pair," ha ha smile.gif

A bit off subject, but what did the Australian guy say when you asked his opinion on the ban of small boobies?!? I am really curious. smile.gif
insideout
Yeah, like I said, the other girls are worse in ways that matter more to me. It's sort of a no win situation, I guess.

So the Australian guy didn't even know about it! But he told me that Australia has a very conservative government that, in his opinion, doesn't represent liberal city dwellers very well. He said that in rural Australia there are a lot of VERY conservative people who support those kinds of absurd laws. And I've read this elsewhere as well.

In any case, he was appalled when I told him. It's good to know we aren't the only ones taking offense!!!!
KeraBear
Wondermist, I just wanted to let you know that I am glad that you are here... not just because of your unique perspective, but because now I am no longer the youngest person posting here! YAY! wink.gif
insideout
I watched Leaves of Grass last night, an awesome but strange movie, and there's a small breasted heroine!!! Not only that, but she's juxtaposed against a large breasted woman who the hero is NOT interested in at all biggrin.gif
I'd recommend it for a happy-boost.
Have an Awesome New Years!
nbdx0645
Happy New Year everybody (and every boobie) smile.gif

Insideout: I'm so sorry that you're being teased. Women should be supporting each other instead of cannibalizing each other, especially when it comes to appearance. If you can, try to speak the truth about your body when she disses it publically. Like with the "no bra" thing, you could say exactly what you wrote to us. "I don't really have to wear a bra for support, but I like to hide the high-beams since they are such a distraction" wink.gif That way, you're kind of educating her (and possibly others around her) that one type of breast isn't better than the other. Tiny boobs are kind of a novelty, some people simply aren't in the know about their awesomeness. I personally wear a bra because my nipples have their party-hats on 24/7!

I think Keri Russel is in LoG. She's such a pretty lady. I never watched the show Felicity, but I always loved her hair when I saw commercials for it. And speaking of hair, I ended up cutting my own bangs (they're a little below eyebrow level and I sweep them to the side.) When I pulled my hair back for the first time, I was looking at my bangs and going "I kind of look like I have a Peter Pan haircut..." and I got a little worried about the slightly androgynous appearance.

But then I decided to take it even further for a NYE party by wearing some relaxed jeans and a black sweater with my hair pulled back. It looked AMAZINGLY HOT! I might end up taking them shorter to be even more pixie-esque when my hair is pulled back. And if I want a softer look, I let down my wavy collarbone-length hair and brush the bangs back. I used to really hate my androgynous features (especially my jawline, build, and small boobs) but now, I like dabbling lightly in what is deemed "boyish" fashion. Maybe I'll wear a tie someday! Or suspenders! biggrin.gif
insideout
Thanks for the advice nbdx! I didn't think about small breast education, but I think that'll be my new outlook on situations like these. It's much harder to be hurt by someone if you think they're stupid, ahem, I mean uninformed ;D

Yeah it is Keri Russell, and I love her character too in LoG.

Androgyny is my specialty biggrin.gif Most of the time I'm sort of frumpy, but when I feel like dressing up I'm a huge fan of the pixie-punk look (but old school, none of this hot topic emo stuff that people love - I find it all too girly actually). So yeah, jeans and a tank top + some converses and a faux-hawk are my usual fare. Although, whenever I cut my hair super-short (which is quite often) I do have a few days of "oh my god I look like a boy" before I get over it and start feeling normal again.

This is the reason I find a lot of the fashion talk around small breasts useless and oftentimes offensive. It's always about hiding them, enhancing them, etc etc. Why not flaunt them just like everyone else? One of my best friends has very small breasts, and I actually have her to thank for my improved self-confidence over the past two years because I fell in love with her body, which is similar enough to mine that felt like a hypocrite getting down on myself! She's absolutely unselfconscious and has the cutest androgynous style ever. She wears little t-shirts with no bra and cargo pants, no makeup EVER, doesn't shave her pits, and usually cuts her own hair pretty short and choppy. And she's sooooo sexy because she owns her look.
karategrrl
QUOTE(insideout @ Jan 1 2011, 04:40 PM) *
One of my best friends has very small breasts, and I actually have her to thank for my improved self-confidence over the past two years because I fell in love with her body, which is similar enough to mine that felt like a hypocrite getting down on myself! She's absolutely unselfconscious and has the cutest androgynous style ever. She wears little t-shirts with no bra and cargo pants, no makeup EVER, doesn't shave her pits, and usually cuts her own hair pretty short and choppy. And she's sooooo sexy because she owns her look.

Sheer awesomeness.

And nbdx, rock the short hair. I used to have that look and I still got stopped in the street with compliments on it--from both men and women, young and old. It is daring and confident.

And I thought you all would love this--hubby bought me a form-fitting thermal shirt for xmas. I ripped off my pajama top at the tree xmas morning and tried it on right htere, and he loved the high-beams I was sporting. Wearing it for real the first time today and he said, "It looks great, except for one thing...you have a bra on." Love it! <3
spot-on
Hey Girls!
Well I am one month out of surgery this week and I am also back at work as a fitness instructor/personal trainer. THoughts 1 month post-op:

No-one says anything, they just look! I mean it''s pretty obvious for those that knew me before that I have implants, cos I went from an A to a D cup! Not only that even though I was wearing a padded bra in my workplace the shape is totally different, they are rounder and fuller. But NOT ONE PERSON has come out and said anything. No co-workers no members or clients. I am almost waiting for the first person to say something to get it out the way smile.gif

I am less boob obsessed. Prior to surgery I used to be checking my bra all the time in mirrors, when I went to the bathroom I'd adjust my boobs in my bra, be conscious of them under clothes etc. Now that has gone. They feel so much a part of me now. I'll be honest and say they've increased my self confidence no end! Just the peace of mind knowing there is no padding hanging out, etc. My boobs never fit well into a bra before, I was very much a sports bra all the time person (good thing considering my job) and now I find my world opened up to bra's that FIT! I've only been bra shopping once so far but it was a much more pleasurable experience smile.gif

Work has been interesting. I've been pretty sore muscle wise from having 3 1/2 weeks off then getting back into routine. All exercises have been fine aside from push ups and chaturanga in yoga. THe pecs flex and the implants move, which is a weird feeling, not uncomfortable or painful it just feels well... weird. I'm modifying as needed for the time being. Everything else has been fine though. Even running and jumping jacks feel fine now, initially they felt weird cos of the weight but used to it now I guess?

I had a clear out of my wardrobe last week. Tried EVERYTHING on and ditched a few items, some too big and a few too small. Too small were button up shirts. So I sacrificed three button up shirts (1 I hadn't worn) for bigger boobs. However some other tops have had to wave goodbye as the boobs are too big for them, like halter tops with fitted bust section or band under the boobs, they are too small in that area, without showing too much upper boob. THings you don't realize when you have small boobs! Trying things on though both my husband and I were amazed how they can look HUGE in one outfit and small in another. Black tends to be smaller, and lighter colors tend to look bigger. Figure hugging obviously shows them off. 90% of my wardrobe IMO looks better, the other 10% looks the same. I bought some things prior to surgery in anticipation of wearing them post-op, one of which was a boob tube type top, no straps, not tight fitting and it looks great and feels good! When I wore that kind of top previously (strapless or halter style) I was always pulling at it trying to get it to look "right" even with a padded push-up on underneath. That constant checking and tugging has gone, just for that peace of mind it was SO worth it!

Right now I feel how I should have looked naturally. Not too big, not too small, perfectly proportioned to my body. So far 1 month later: I love them. Would I do it all over again? Yes definitely. My only regret so far: that I waited till I was 38!

I should have new pics soon and will email those gals that contacted me smile.gif
strongirl
Hey Spot-on, thanks so much for your honest and thorough updates and willingness to share! It is so nice of you to do that for all of us. I'm really glad (and frankly, relieved) that everything went well and that you are so pleased. Whew! Congratulations! Yay! smile.gif

I'm curious though about how or whether it has affected your sex life...and also find it interesting that you didn't even mention that in your 1 month update. So was that not really much of a motivator for you? And how has it been? How has your spouse reacted to them?

When I've thought about implants for myself (which hasn't been often) pretty much my only motivation would be if it would add some extra fun to sex. The oft-mentioned motivators of improved self-confidence, fitting better in clothes, feeling more "normal", don't really resonate with me much. But I love sex and go to some effort to keep my sex life lively and exciting and if implants would promote that, then that would be a plus. However, both my ex-husband and my current bf strongly prefer small natural breasts, so I've known with those relationships at least, it would backfire. The bf has made it quite clear that he is strongly opposed to implants and dearly loves my 34A's. And while it is my body and my decision, I like to keep him happy...and horny. wink.gif
spot-on
Hi Strongirl
Nope sex life was not a big motivator for me, sure it was part of it but not a huge part.

When I initially broached the subject of surgery to my husband he said straight out that he didn't care how small/large my boobs were, and if I was doing it for him not to bother. He wasn't/isn't a boob man always been an ass man. He quizzed me making sure I was doing this for ME and not our sex life or for him. He loved my boobs before and he loves them now. He loves them because they are part of me.That said he does look at my boobs more, and fondles them more, but usually that's because I'm asking him how soft they feel compared to week 1, and he is obviously my photographer for my progress pics wink.gif He was also the 'judge' of clothing when I was deciding what looked good now. So his input is important, his opinion hasn't changed. He loved me regardless.

So far our sex life is pretty much the same, BUT we haven't had much chance to get busy with it wink.gif For 3 weeks I couldn't elevate my heart rate (which is honestly no fun for sex), and this week I've been back at work teaching classes and clients (after a 3 1/2 week break) which has pretty much seen me asleep on the sofa every night at around 10.30, and if I am honest a napped a couple of afternoons too. Once I get back into the swing of things, that may improve wink.gif Next week will be a full week again and hopefully I'll be more in shape again.

I will say that they are more of a turn on for me personally. I like having them held/stroked etc, and I like touching them myself. I like unleashing them from their clothing and seeing my husbands reaction. Generally I just like them a lot. Especially now they are getting softer/smushier. I honestly think they are a bigger turn on for me than my husband... but like I said... early days. I'll ask his honest opinion from before/after and let you know smile.gif
insideout
Anyone else here an astrology nut? I don't take it for fact, but it is one of my favorite "slacker" activities. I'd recommend the book Sextrology, it's very fun to read and takes a very comprehensive approach to addressing sun signs and their sex lives. Anyways, I'm a cancer, and according to this book most cancers suffer from "breast envy" whether they're large or small because the sign rules the breasts and ovaries. This is sort of true for me, but upon closer examination of my own thoughts I've found that I don't envy other breasts, just what it means to have them. I realize that's sort of a roundabout statement; what I mean is this: I don't want my friend's large breasts. Most of the time I don't want larger breasts myself. What I want is to be sexy. It's been said on here before, but I want my small breasts to be sexy to other people just the way they are.

So I suppose if I were to write to the authors of Sextrology, I'd say that what I have is more of a fixation on breasts, not necessarily "breast envy."

I think I will make it a habit to end on a positive note: boys love how sensitive my nipples are, and I'm sure the look on a guy's face when he's met with a pair of knockers would pale in comparison to the look on a guy's face when I respond to his touch biggrin.gif I always tell myself, gratitude is the sexiest thing ever, and that's the gift that keeps on giving (but yelling "thank you" over and over again while having an orgasm, although perhaps a genuine sentiment, will make for amusing afterdinner entertainment for the neighbors . . .)
strongirl
Hey Spot-on, thanks for the reply! Keep those updates coming. (and I hope you guys have more time to "get busy" soon!)

insideout, re. the sensitivity thing: HELL YES! We've talked about this in here before but I'm not sure if you were around then. A number of us smallies reported that we can actually climax on nip stim alone. It happens to me every now and again and I still find it amazing. It's one of the reasons my bf is so strongly opposed to implants - sometimes they reduce sensitivity and he says there's no way size could compare to the turn-on he gets from my responsiveness.

I almost wonder if this is a factor of size itself - with a finite number of nerve endings, would they be more sensitive if they are all bunched up together in a small area rather than spread out over large area? I dunno.

karategrrl
Since we've discussed plastic surgery and body image a lot here, I thought I'd post this--link to images from a new book by the photogprhaer Toledano. Click the right-hand buttons to see the pics.
Ick.
http://www.mrtoledano.com/A-new-kind-of-be...-kind-of-beauty
spot-on
I'd heard stories of women losing sensation in the nipples etc, but mine... um hell yeah I have feeling there! I can only speak for myself obviously but my nips are WAY more sensitive now post surgery

Again just my experience!


And yes I hope we get more action soon too! Though most nights I am finishing work at 8pm ,dinner, walk dogs, then falling asleep! Crazy time of year for my industry but I love it smile.gif

QUOTE(strongirl @ Jan 11 2011, 08:30 AM) *
Hey Spot-on, thanks for the reply! Keep those updates coming. (and I hope you guys have more time to "get busy" soon!)

insideout, re. the sensitivity thing: HELL YES! We've talked about this in here before but I'm not sure if you were around then. A number of us smallies reported that we can actually climax on nip stim alone. It happens to me every now and again and I still find it amazing. It's one of the reasons my bf is so strongly opposed to implants - sometimes they reduce sensitivity and he says there's no way size could compare to the turn-on he gets from my responsiveness.

I almost wonder if this is a factor of size itself - with a finite number of nerve endings, would they be more sensitive if they are all bunched up together in a small area rather than spread out over large area? I dunno.

strongirl
Wow, karategrrl, that sure was a bizarre little experience checking out those photos! Tres creepy, in my opinion! I think it is thoughtfully done and artful - I appreciate the work, both photographic and surgical. But whew. Disturbing and chilly. It is one thing to try to enhance nature but these photos look like people who are almost completely disassociating from it.
karategrrl
QUOTE(strongirl @ Jan 14 2011, 05:18 PM) *
Wow, karategrrl, that sure was a bizarre little experience checking out those photos! Tres creepy, in my opinion! I think it is thoughtfully done and artful - I appreciate the work, both photographic and surgical. But whew. Disturbing and chilly. It is one thing to try to enhance nature but these photos look like people who are almost completely disassociating from it.


I hear ya. Ironically, I think most of these folks ended up looking similar to one another--like some creepy new race. Of course, not everyone who's had surgery looks like this. I think these were carefully chosen.
KeraBear
QUOTE(strongirl @ Jan 11 2011, 11:30 AM) *
I almost wonder if this is a factor of size itself - with a finite number of nerve endings, would they be more sensitive if they are all bunched up together in a small area rather than spread out over large area? I dunno.


I have wondered this myself. If there is a study being conducted, I would be willing to participate!
tongue.gif

By the way, have you noticed my post count has dropped lately? School has started again.

dry.gif

Boooooo
nbdx0645
I picked up the latest Cosmopolitan at Boarders and thumbed through it. There's a small write-up about A-cups and how more women want less padding. It pointed out the obvious "no back pain" "looks younger" "less likely to get headaches" and it did talk about the sensitivity. A sexologist claimed that stimulation was more intense because there's less fat tissue covering up the nerve endings. If anybody has the Cosmo with Mila Kunis on the cover, could you provide a quote? I didn't buy the magazine...I usually pick it up to read the women's issues articles. I saw the article and was taken aback; then I skimmed the remainder of the magazine to see many images of women with big breasts for their frames. Some consistency from article-to-article would make the article's message stronger. Maybe I'm being overly critical since I'm a graphic designer for large publications.
insideout
nbdx I agree with you. Big magazines like that just pander to different groups of their readership by publishing an article here or there to make them happy, but their bottom line is money so they'll never be sending a clear message. It's just business, but I find it insulting how gullible they think we are. I actually wish that small breasts would stop being pointed out in the media whether for good or bad - even "good" or "nice" articles are really just pandering to the rule that bigger is better. If you ask me, we shouldn't even be acknowledging this rule, so what is there to write about? If a guy were to say to me "your breasts are small," (or an insult, etc.) I wouldn't reply with "uh, well, they don't cause back pain and they will look more youthful in 20 years . . ." no! I'd say fuck you! My philosophy: there is no case to be made to anyone but ourselves in our own heads and forums.
And something positive: another story. There's a girl who works in the building where I live and she's insulted me about different things over the past few months. I've usually let it slide because people have suggested it's a culture thing :/ Anyways, a friend of mine related a conversation he had with her. It went something like this:
Girl: Do you like insideout?
Boy: No.
G: Is it because she has small breasts?
B: It's because we're good friends . . .
So he tells me about this and I'm livid. Then the other night we're walking back from dinner and I make a comment about how she and I are the same height, but I was speaking a different language so I guess I accidentally said we have the same body (because height is literally just "body length" in this language, and I left out the length part). And then she said "yeah we both have small breasts" in a sad voice. So I said "I love my small breasts!" The look on her face said she was really surprised yet glad to hear such blasphemy (note sarcasm). Anyway it's a positive because I found out why she said such a thing to my friend (her own insecurities, isn't that always the culprit), I made her feel better about her body, and I felt better about my own mental health being able to say that out loud with so many people around - never done that before!
karategrrl
QUOTE(insideout @ Jan 17 2011, 04:54 AM) *
Big magazines like that just pander to different groups of their readership by publishing an article here or there to make them happy, but their bottom line is money so they'll never be sending a clear message. It's just business, but I find it insulting how gullible they think we are. I actually wish that small breasts would stop being pointed out in the media whether for good or bad - even "good" or "nice" articles are really just pandering to the rule that bigger is better.

YEP!! that's why I looooove Milla Jovovich movies. She's hot as hell (just saw clips of one of the Resident Evil movies where she's wearing this little white tank top with nip erections...aww yeah!). But anyway, no one ever says in her movies, "Yeah, <character's name> is hot, even with her small breasts." She's just HOT. Period.

QUOTE(insideout @ Jan 17 2011, 04:54 AM) *
I felt better about my own mental health being able to say that out loud with so many people around - never done that before!

Good for you!!
strongirl
Came across a pretty well-written article about one woman's experiences with her breast implants. I think she does a good job of explaining her thought processes around all of it. I had mixed feelings about the ending but one of the commenters flipped it around in an interesting way, so read the comments.

This line from the article struck me as being kind of a combination of perspectives from some of us who post in here:

"In spite of my discovery that a sizable male population was rapturously devoted to ­daintily bosomed females, I perceived the stacked as possessing a primeval power, an elusive feminine mystique."

http://www.elle.com/Beauty/Health-Fitness/...Breast-Implants
spot-on
Great article Strongirl, I read that last year before my surgery. However there are a few points in it that I want to comment on

QUOTE
“Two hundred cc for both left and right,” he said. Although it takes about 200 cc to increase your bra size by one cup (and 440 cc equals approximately one pound), my 200 cc must have consisted of Wonder Molecules, as my new bra measurements doubled from a 32A to a 34C—a full C"


a 34C is a 32B so she actually got what she wished for. Not sure if she put on some weight that made her band size go up, but there is no reason her ribcage measurement should change once initial swelling goes down. And the rule of 200cc to increase 1 cup size isn't true. It totally depends on the persons body size. 200cc is going to go much further on a smaller framed girl, than a larger girl with a wider ridcage!

The risk of rupture is the main reason I went with silicone. Silicone ruptures are fairly common, and one reason they now overfill them which makes them firmer.

Also about the comments.

QUOTE
For the women who do have it done, it must be great to get the attention of guys. But then again do you really want the attention of a guy who rarely makes eye contact? Wouldn't you want to be approached by the guy who prefers you unenhanced?


Honestly I haven't had any more/less attention from guys than I did before, but then that wasn't my objective and no do I dress in a revealing way. I also don't want to be approached by any guys, that's not why I did this AND I'm happily married! Why do people automatically assume women alter their bodies in ANY way to please or attract men? No sorry I did the surgery for ME! It HAS improved my self esteem and confidence a lot and so far I am very happy with the results.

When I previously heard women say "I did this for myself" I admit I thought that they really did it for male attention and I do think that some women do, BUT the great MAJORITY of women do this surgery to make themselves feel better, not to "hook a man". There are many references about men loving small/large/real/fake tits and honestly it shouldn't matter and who gives a flying fuck what they prefer?! If a guy is interested in YOU then only YOU matter regardless of the size of your boobs!!! If you want to shave your head, tattoo your face, get implants, piercings etc the guy should still love you, because you are the same person. They should be attracted to who you are not what you look like


spot-on
Milla rocks! And Olivia Wilde (new Tron movie not seen it but she was hot in House). I think we've discussed it before but CONFIDENCE in your body is the key! Doesn't matter if you are stick thin, balloons for boobs, small boobs, or obese etc, if you have confidence then you are sexy as hell!!!

That's the thing with women like Milla, Olivia etc. They have confidence in buckets!

QUOTE(karategrrl @ Jan 17 2011, 05:07 AM) *
YEP!! that's why I looooove Milla Jovovich movies. She's hot as hell (just saw clips of one of the Resident Evil movies where she's wearing this little white tank top with nip erections...aww yeah!). But anyway, no one ever says in her movies, "Yeah, <character's name> is hot, even with her small breasts." She's just HOT. Period.

strongirl
Yeah, while we're on the smallie celeb thing, I came across something about Rachel McAdams today and didn't know who she was, so I googled her. Very attractive small-breasted hottie! I googled images and enjoyed several pics of her rocking that really low cut look.

And Natalie Portman sure is getting a lot of attention these days. I've always thought she was so gorgeous in such a classy way.
nbdx0645
QUOTE(spot-on @ Jan 20 2011, 04:42 PM) *
a 34C is a 32B so she actually got what she wished for.


When the band size goes down (in this case from 34 to 32,) the cup size goes up, so it's actually a 32D.

Forgive me for my thoughts, but I do feel like implants are a means to correct a perceived deficiency that doesn't really exist. Small breasts on any type of body are completely normal and healthy, they're able to produce milk and receive pleasure. So where's the disconnect? I agree with the previously quoted comment to an extent, because I don't believe that we should be such high monitors of our physical appearance and we shouldn't place such a high value on "looking better" for others, and even for ourselves. I think about how much time I spend staring at my breasts, and then I think about how much time I gaze at my coworkers, family and friends. I don't know if I could really say that an enhancement would only be for myself. I forget what my breasts look like in my day-to-day life. I forget what my entire body looks like most of the time. Do I think that implants are a self-fulfilling prophecy? You betcha. Once you convince yourself, the universe falls into place. But what I'm saying is one opinion and I'm hoping that it isn't taken personally.
karategrrl
QUOTE(nbdx0645 @ Jan 21 2011, 01:15 AM) *
Forgive me for my thoughts, but I do feel like implants are a means to correct a perceived deficiency that doesn't really exist.

Nothing personal either, but I agree. Sometimes I look in the mirror and feel "deficient," then I wonder if I would feel that way if every woman in the world has breasts my size. Or if mine were bigger than everyone else's, would I feel mine were "too big" and consider reduction? It's really all so relative. I think the issue is not that anyone's too big or small or too whatever, but our own difficulties with acceptance of ourselves. Small breasts are normal. It's our mindset about them that's not.

And I'll be the first to admit my hypocrisy, for sometimes I just wish I were a little bigger in the bust. Then again, if I could, I'd have non-grey hair, smaller hands and feet, longer legs, no cellulite on my butt, darker skin, etc. So either I'm going to make myself nuts over everything I'm "not" or look at everything going on with me that's beautiful and lovely and love myself the way I am. Once I get in that mode I really do think I look pretty darn great. smile.gif I think a lot of the problem is that we jsut get bored looking at ourselves and become blind to our own beauty.

And spot-on, nothing personal at all, really. While I don't feel implants are for me and I have some definite viewpoints on the topic, each has their own path to take. I'm just glad you are, healthwise, okay. And you didn't go overbaord with the size.

Thanks you for the link to that article. The cutesy tone in which it was written got annoying but the content was quite interesting, as was the commenter who said she's lso had hers removed and wishes she'd never messed with 'em.
insideout
I have to agree with nbdx again. In Tibet, nomad women have dark skin, and Tibetans in general have darker skin than the Chinese. Throughout Asia light skin is considered more beautiful and more desireable than dark skin, and because of this, Tibetan women especially want to have lighter skin - it not only looks more Chinese, it also looks more Western. So they buy skin whitening products which are, needless to say, not healthy or safe to use. I don't believe for one second that any of these women are doing this for themselves. They're doing it because of societal pressures. Does it matter that they think themselves more beautiful with lighter skin? I hope not. I hope what matters more is this: that a culture where the dark skin and red cheeks of a nomad used to be a source of pride is now being undermined because of naturally unattainable beauty standards.

So how is skin whitening any different from breast implants? In light of that question, I can't just shrug my shoulders and submit that such practices are done by women for women, as if they are some empowering procedure. What is happening to Tibetan women, although done of their own free will, is not empowering. It is sad.

That, I suppose, is just my opinion, and if anyone has a problem with it they can take it up with me. The rest of what I've said is fact, and I think they're facts worth considering when we draw our conclusions about augmentation and other procedures. I talk about Tibet because it is a place I've become intimately familiar with, but even closer to home issues of skin color and beauty standards exist. What if whitening became popular in the U.S. or Europe? Would body modification according to a beauty standard still be so acceptable, and even worse, expected? I should hope not. And I also wish that it didn't take the touchy subject of race to bring to light the backward nature of such societal practices.

If I've caused too much of a stir, feel free to yell at me smile.gif
strongirl
Insideout, people better not yell at you and I don't think they will. Nor should anyone yell at or disparage Spot-on for her choice. In the aftermath of the Arizona shooting and political reaction, I've given a lot of thought to how to promote civil discourse and respectful disagreement. If the rest of the world could pull that off like we do in here, it would be a wonderful thing. One of the things I love about our dialogue is that it lets me try on different perspectives in my own head, shift things around, work it out, acknowledge my own inner conflicts...instead of picking a "side" and sticking to it in a dogmatic, stubborn, self-righteous way. I think it is really wonderful that we can use this space to do that - to be honest, caring, and respectful even as we share different perspectives. Much appreciation to all who post here!

I think Spot-on was really brave to risk rejection and criticism by sharing her choice with us so openly and I think it's extremely generous of her to invite questions and give honest answers to help those of us who have considered implants or even just wondered what it's like. I've also found it heartwarming to see those of us who oppose implants continue to be kind and supportive of her. And I think it is totally legit to continue to voice opposition to implants as a cultural phenomenon and to reject it as a personal choice for ourselves, even while we continue to respect that it IS a choice.

I agree with Nbdx and Insideout about implants and skin lightening correcting perceived deficiencies that don't really exist and I feel sad to see those as a widespread cultural phenomenon, too. At the same time, I respect people's personal choice to modify their bodies in any way they choose that makes them feel better and enjoy their physical being more - whether it's tats, haircolor, or implants. And knowing that Spot-on got what she wanted without medical problems makes me feel happy.

So I feel sad about the cultural phenomenon of implants and happy about her individual outcome with implants at the same time. It's a bit twisted but I'm comfortable here.



spot-on
yes you're right I had that backwards, this is what I get for checking in between work shifts. The point I wanted to make was Her band size SHOULDN'T have increased. She noted she was a 32A before implants, and a 34C after, which as you said was a 32D meaning she went up 3 cups sizes. At most with 200cc's and her small ribcage I'd say she was a small 32C, I only say this cos I got 350cc and ended up a 32DD. There is NO WAY she increased 3 sizes with less than 200cc. As she noted its roughly 200cc for one cup size increase, like I said she's smaller but sorry NOPE no way she got 3+ cups increase with less than 200cc. More likely she put on some lbs and gained some extra boobage from fat.

I agree with what you said to an extent, we shouldn't place such a high value on "looking better" but I think it depends on the person. I guess I am more aware of how my body looks because it's my job. It's hard not to want that perfect body when that is what my clients expect me to have? I see myself full on in a mirror for 2-3 hours a day. Its hard to escape looking at yourself when you're the person in front of the class being looked at by 20-30 people. There IS a pressure to be "perfect" in the fitness industry, and I am sure in many other industries. That said the surgery route was one I had thought about on and off for 20 years, for my OWN reasons not because of anything listed above, I thought about surgery before I was in fitness.Sure small breasts are completely normal and healthy and able to serve their biological and sexual purpose. The disconnect for me was how I felt emotionally. Sure the physical, health, sexual aspects are important but so is mental health. Spending 20 years flip flopping between trying to embrace my small breasts, coveting larger breasts, wearing padded bras took its toll, plus like you said the time spent staring at breasts (mine and others).

I am totally grateful for everything my body can do, and that it's healthy. If there is a perceived deficiency it is real to the person it affects right? I think there are women who are 100% happy with their bodies regardless of size/shape and more power to them. But then there are women who aren't happy. And that's why we have spanx, hair dye, make-up, padded bra's etc. Again JMO

QUOTE(nbdx0645 @ Jan 20 2011, 05:15 PM) *
When the band size goes down (in this case from 34 to 32,) the cup size goes up, so it's actually a 32D.

Forgive me for my thoughts, but I do feel like implants are a means to correct a perceived deficiency that doesn't really exist. Small breasts on any type of body are completely normal and healthy, they're able to produce milk and receive pleasure. So where's the disconnect? I agree with the previously quoted comment to an extent, because I don't believe that we should be such high monitors of our physical appearance and we shouldn't place such a high value on "looking better" for others, and even for ourselves. I think about how much time I spend staring at my breasts, and then I think about how much time I gaze at my coworkers, family and friends. I don't know if I could really say that an enhancement would only be for myself. I forget what my breasts look like in my day-to-day life. I forget what my entire body looks like most of the time. Do I think that implants are a self-fulfilling prophecy? You betcha. Once you convince yourself, the universe falls into place. But what I'm saying is one opinion and I'm hoping that it isn't taken personally.

spot-on
Insideout: I actually think you bring up good points.

How is surgery different from skin whitening? teeth whitening? Hair dye? Tattoos? Make-up? Body shaping clothing? etc? Other than it's more permanent (kinda) than padding?

I personally don't do any of the above because of societal pressures. I'm not the kind of person that can't leave the house without make-up for example, yet I did have silicone shoved into my boobs. It's an emotional journey. I don't want to look like someone else (like the Tibetans - Chinese) I just don't feel like I was in the body I was supposed to be in.

Strongrl thanks for the comments. For 20 years I've wanted bigger boobs but settled with what I had because surgery is risky. I hated how I looked IRL and in photo's, wearing padded bra's all the time, padded swimsuits etc. Like I said previously you're saying PHYSICAL deficiencies don't exist and they don't, small breast function exactly the same as large breasts. BUT the emotional deficiency exists otherwise this forum wouldn't exist! I do think there are women that ROCK the small breasts braless and all, but that wasn't me and I decided after 20 years it never was going to be me. I was never going to be happy with what I had.

I will say that I feel sexier and am definitely more easily turned on post-surgery. Not because my boobs are bigger, or people are looking at me different (so far only TWO people have asked in the 6 weeks!) but because I am emotionally different. I am more confident in how I look and I've said before CONFIDENCE in how you look is sexier than ANYTHING!

As for the opposition of implants, well be careful, lol! I was an implant opposer remember!
nbdx0645
I'm a programmer/designer that sits in a cube and I never really thought what it'd be like to be a body on display. I also feel a little bummed because of the pressure that creeps up in professions like personal training and ballet. I stated to my friends before "I'm not a stripper; beauty is irrelevant" but I remember working retail at a fashion store, I really felt insecure with my appearance. Especially when customers (male and female) would eye me over. It felt like an invasion of privacy for $8/hour. I think the worst kinds of insecurities came from women who would tell me how perfect my skinny body was and how they'd kill to be my dress size. Or that they missed being that slim. I think that hurt worst of all, because it felt like my existence was hurting them.

I've looked at my emotional deficiency as a mental issue and worked with a counselor to break down some of the false truths I made about my body. I needed intervention too, something had to change, so I saw a different kind of specialist.

I really like Strongirl's quote, "So I feel sad about the cultural phenomenon of implants and happy about her individual outcome with implants at the same time." The weirdness feels like a buffer overflow -- there's a part of me that wants to scoff at the ridiculousness that is elective surgery for aesthetic gain (I'm throwing out the "v" word, vanity), and there's another part where I feel thankful that we have these options so we can give patients regulated and safe care. It just feels like implants shouldn't be the first method. It should be the last resort.

Or should breasts even be an issue to start with?
nbdx0645
QUOTE(spot-on @ Jan 21 2011, 05:20 PM) *
As for the opposition of implants, well be careful, lol! I was an implant opposer remember!



Geez, this sounds incredibly condescending. Reminds me of "yeah you're pro-life until you get pregnant." Keep it respectful.
discowombat
QUOTE(nbdx0645 @ Jan 21 2011, 07:43 PM) *
Geez, this sounds incredibly condescending. Reminds me of "yeah you're pro-life until you get pregnant." Keep it respectful.


I don't think she meant it in a disrespectful way. I have been around the forum for several years between two different screen names and she's just stating a fact about her experience.
nbdx0645
QUOTE(discowombat @ Jan 22 2011, 06:04 AM) *
I don't think she meant it in a disrespectful way. I have been around the forum for several years between two different screen names and she's just stating a fact about her experience.


As I saw it last night, she's stating her experience and projecting. It felt flippant.
I'm really, really tired of thinking about boobs. I'm going to go enjoy my weekend.
discowombat
QUOTE(nbdx0645 @ Jan 22 2011, 09:11 AM) *
As I saw it last night, she's stating her experience and projecting. It felt flippant.


You are entitled to your opinion. I didn't think she was implying that everyone will feel that way, but rather that it could happened since it happened to her. Personally, I took no issue with it. I'm just grateful that she has been so willing to share her experience with us. I'm sure she's not the first or last person here that might go the implant route, but I think she is the first person to share so openly. I appreciate it even if it not the choice for me.
karategrrl
There were SO many comments I was going to quote in a reply, until it just got ridiculous. So let me just say I SO appreciate the strong, intelligent, respectful dialogue here.

I think strongirl said it best:

"If the rest of the world could pull that off like we do in here, it would be a wonderful thing. One of the things I love about our dialogue is that it lets me try on different perspectives in my own head, shift things around, work it out, acknowledge my own inner conflicts...instead of picking a "side" and sticking to it in a dogmatic, stubborn, self-righteous way. I think it is really wonderful that we can use this space to do that - to be honest, caring, and respectful even as we share different perspectives."

I, too, have pondered my own acceptance of spot-on's choice with my personal (mostly negative) feelings about breast implants. I used to be VERY black or white about so many things, esp. when I was younger, but lately I observe my inner dialouge objectively, personally hashing out my own opposing viewpoints...
insideout
I suppose objectively everyone is going to do what's right for them. But I also can't help but notice that beauty standards are perpetuated in large part because of the people who react to them - i.e. people who get implants. And that's not a subjective opinion, that's just reality. Every augmentation preformed, no matter the reason behind it, is a reaffirmation of that standard.

And Spot-on I think this statement you made:
"How is surgery different from skin whitening? teeth whitening? Hair dye? Tattoos? Make-up? Body shaping clothing? etc? Other than it's more permanent (kinda) than padding?"
is an interesting one, but I can't agree with everything. Tattoos, for example, are not a beauty standard in the West. That is, if we define a beauty standard as a preference held by the majority or an opinion of bodily perfection held by the majority, then tattoos clearly do not fit. As for your other examples, I don't take as much issue with the rest because they are not permanent. You could have just as well listed shaving or hair styling. I think those sorts of things are different because not only are they reversible, they're uninvasive. That doesn't make them any less of an issue, but I think they must be considered in a different context.

In any case, there's a lot to think about here.

On a positive note: I went to a hot spring yesterday where bathing suits weren't allowed laugh.gif At first I was terrified to be naked in front of strangers and friends, but after I saw how normal it was for Tibetans I loosened up and enjoyed the experience. There are so many different body types out there, and it was refreshing to be among people who clearly did not care what their bodies looked like naked. I saw the whole range of breast size/type on a whole range of ages and guess what? They were all beautiful! We were a bit of a spectacle though . . . Tibetans don't have ANY body hair: no pubic hair, arm hair, leg hair, nothing! So we must have looked like hairy beasts, myself especially since I don't shave!!! They don't know how lucky they are . . .
spot-on
That is EXACTLY how I meant it, no condescending attitute or disrespect implied, and was in NO WAY projecting! All of you who knew me in the past and the struggles I have had with my breast insecurities KNOW that I was VERY openly vocal about my opposition to implants. I was just lightheartedly saying that you MAY find in the future that your opinion and attitude towards it may change.

QUOTE(discowombat @ Jan 22 2011, 04:04 AM) *
I don't think she meant it in a disrespectful way. I have been around the forum for several years between two different screen names and she's just stating a fact about her experience.

spot-on
When you do have your body on display it's hard NOT to judge yourself or hold yourself to an ideal. Like nbdx0645 said "I'm not a stripper; beauty is irrelevant" but when public eyes are on you ALL DAY, in workout clothes it's hard NOT to get drawn into vanity to an extent. I have to have a professional exterior and "walk the walk" as well as talk the talk.


I've only contributed here recently because I wanted to voice the opinion of someone who was the same and chose the surgery route and wanted to offer my experience (good or bad). Lately though I just feel attacked. Before my surgery I admit to being catty about women who had chosen the surgery, I've stated similar opinions on here about my opposition in the past to this surgery. But what I've learned over the last 6 months is that you have to do what is right for you. I've already gone over my own personal reasons for implants but for me there was also the added factor of having gone through all this unhappiness concerning my breasts for over 20 years. I tried various natural methods which don't work, and my attitude was NOT changing. I was in turmoil over having a great athletic body with small breasts. Perfectly healthy and biologically sound small breasts, but *I* wasn't happy. I can honestly say hand on heart I am 100% happy with my decision and it was right FOR ME. I totally appreciate and understand that it's not right for everyone.


All that said, I am bowing out of this forum. If any of you want to continue to contact me for surgery updates and info you have my email.

dj-bizmonkey
hi everyone! it has been a loooooong time since i posted in this thread or on bust in general. however it was this thread that actually introduced me to the bust lounge nearly a decade ago. i was a young lady, just starting off to college and completely struggling with my body image. i honestly don't think i'd be as comfortable as i am now if it hadn't been for all the great support and advice from the plethora of fabulous women here.

*waves* hi karategrrl! i've missed our exchanges!!

i've been back through reading the posts over the last few pages and a lot of good points have been made. i'm also glad to see there has been a general shortage of trolls, because any thread with the word 'breast' in the title certainly attracts the creepazoids.

QUOTE(insideout @ Jan 24 2011, 10:42 AM) *
I suppose objectively everyone is going to do what's right for them. But I also can't help but notice that beauty standards are perpetuated in large part because of the people who react to them - i.e. people who get implants. And that's not a subjective opinion, that's just reality. Every augmentation preformed, no matter the reason behind it, is a reaffirmation of that standard.


i totally agree with this statement. on the one hand, when it comes to plastic surgery i always think, never say never. i also am a firm believer in individual choice and freedom and i think 99% of the time, it trumps "the greater good," however that might be interpreted. that being said, on a personal level, i do feel kind of betrayed when a small breasted woman gets implants. in our celebrity obsessed culture in the USA, it especially bugs me when small breasted actresses cave to the hollywood pressure. i remember being particularly upset when Kate Hudson, especially after hearing what an asshole A-Rod was to her about them. she's still beautiful and she had them done tastefully, but i was disappointed nonetheless.

i don't want to make spot-on feel like Benedict Arnold, however, because i 100% respect her choice to do whatever the fuck she wants with her own body and her own money. if it floats your boat, more power to you, who am i to stand in the way of your happiness and satisfaction?

i could never opt for surgery myself, because it is such a commitment of money, energy and to future surgeries. that being said, if you could give me a pill that would make my breasts grow naturally, i might be inclined to take it. by my own logic, i'd be betraying my other small breasted sisters.

at the end of the day, nothing is sexier than confidence. you can have the perfect body and still be unattractive if you have a terrible personality or no feeling of self-worth.

i just read this article: http://goodmenproject.com/featured-content...-wrong-reasons/

the comments are especially heartening and i love that this website even exists! we are products of our media-saturated culture. Sure, boobs have been objects of obsession since the beginning of time, however their sexualization is highly culturally based. in katherine dettwyler's work on breastfeeding and breast perception in modern and traditional societies, she found over 100 societies were breasts were not seen as sexual, i.e. they were not ogled, fondled or featured in sexual activity. i think a lot of people are uncomfortable with the idea that this is a cultural, not a biological issue.

it is especially difficult to combat this obsession now because of the amount of media we are all exposed to whether we like it or not. we are products of our culture, even if we rebel against it, and our unconscious minds are shaped by forces we are by definition, unaware of.

i'm not sure where i was going with that, suffice to say, you shouldn't beat yourself up or anyone else for feeling inadequate in the body you've been given. once you are aware of why you feel the way you do, you can make an informed decision as to how to proceed. for some of us, that may be surgery, for others, it may be an erect middle finger at society, and for others still, a zen acceptance of the world and ourselves, as flawed.
nbdx0645
QUOTE(spot-on @ Jan 24 2011, 02:54 PM) *
That is EXACTLY how I meant it, no condescending attitute or disrespect implied, and was in NO WAY projecting! All of you who knew me in the past and the struggles I have had with my breast insecurities KNOW that I was VERY openly vocal about my opposition to implants. I was just lightheartedly saying that you MAY find in the future that your opinion and attitude towards it may change.


I don't know if you'll be checking the thread still, but I sincerely thank you for saying this and I'm sorry that I took it the wrong (very wrong) way. I recall how hard the journey was for you, and I truly apologize for causing you any additional grief by bringing up a voice of dissent. It'd all be so much clearer if we were in the same room together. You've all been in the back of my mind for the last few days. I haven't been thinking about boobs; it's about the soul.

We can all acknowledge that we've been through emotional hell with our bodies and we want to work to break the negativity that we've attached to our bodies. Breast shame is a topic that's not easily addressed; it's one that causes women to medicate themselves with social/sexual withdrawal, substance abuse, disordered eating, self-harm, and suicide. I also feel that augmentation can be a reaffirmation of standards and stereotypes; implants are something that I've felt quite inflexible on for a long, long time. The last few months have made me revisit and seriously scrutinize both sides of the issue. I'm still battling for resolution. However, the revisit brought up a personal note: my mom and I, despite her implantedness for the last 20-something years (with ~3 years of me being "in the know") still talk, still get lunch, still do what moms and daughters do. We have our bumps and distractions (who doesn't? My mom is the most paranoid creature on the planet and I'm a crazy Atheist daredevil child with 3 'murdercycles') but...her boobs really are irrelevant. I love my mom. I'm glad that in spite of everything, we support and care for one another.
karategrrl
QUOTE(dj-bizmonkey @ Jan 24 2011, 09:47 PM) *
for some of us, that may be surgery, for others, it may be an erect middle finger at society, and for others still, a zen acceptance of the world and ourselves, as flawed.

laugh.gif laugh.gif laugh.gif laugh.gif laugh.gif LOVE IT!!! Welcome back! We've missed you!

What synchroniciity, DJ!!! I was just thinking about you the other day and wondering where the hell you've been!!!!!!!!!!! Warm small-booby hugs to you!!!!!!!!!

Yeah, I too have to say I do feel betrayed when others choose surgery. And yeah again--I could never undergo that myself but if there was a pill or something safe, easy, and didn't stand me on the road to future additonal surgeries, I'd probably do it.

I feel bad that spot-on is leaving the forum but since it's a small breast support forum, well, I understand.

I have to say, too, that I've listened to some breast enlargement hypnotherapy and though I can't vouch for the effectiveness (I've not been disciplined and doing it even half as often as you are supposed to), I have to say it has, ironically, been great for me loving what I have. Like, instead of feeling like I want them bigger and THEN I'd love them, my mind shift is now more like, I send them love and since I love them so much, I just want MORE of them. If that makes any sense.
karategrrl
OMG DJ, Thank you for that link! Amazing article by a man who <gasp> GETS IT.

(And thanks for helping me rediscover the Good Men Project!)
karategrrl
Heh heh, interesting "befores" and "afters" here:

Worst of Photoshop
KeraBear
Awww, it's too bad that Spot-on decided to leave. Actually I am really surprised that things didn't turn "ugly" earlier. Actually, if you take out the miscommunication between Spot on and nbdx, things were seemed pretty civil for the most part. But it was pretty inevitable that some of the anti-implant feelings would surface once again - based on past conversations about it anyways. It was weird because for awhile it felt like we were celebrating plastic surgery. And I was like, "noooooooo not in the small boobie forum!" ha ha

Spot-on, thank you again for being so willing to be open and honest about your experience. I did find it all quite intriguing. Feel free to poke in here every now and then even though you are not officially in the "club" anymore. smile.gif
karategrrl
QUOTE(KeraBear @ Jan 25 2011, 11:43 PM) *
It was weird because for awhile it felt like we were celebrating plastic surgery. And I was like, "noooooooo not in the small boobie forum!"

Me too. I was hoping this forum wasn't going to go too far from small boob support. I wasn't thrilled at first, but I'm really glad she shared. I've never known anyone I was close enough to who had it done, and I guess here there's a certain amount of privacy--I mean, she sent before and after photos when I asked, and answered any and all questions we all asked. So I must say I learned a lot. But she never pushed any of it on any of us, never said any of us should do it--she just spoke purely from her own experience. And, considering a lot of our own anti-implant feelings, I think we all kept it very civil and surprisingly supportive. That's why I love you guys. smile.gif

And I have to say I posted, on Facebook, that article DJ shared. Not ONE person commented. Of note was that I posted, right after it, something unrelated that was kind of stupid-funny, and of course, I got 4 "Likes." I've given up on FB for anything remotely intellectual. I'll get that here.
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