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bklynhermit
one thing i've realized for myself is that when i am in a serious relationship, there are NO CLOSED DOORS when it comes to sex. there is ultimately no such thing as 'my sex life', it is 'our sex life', because every choice i make sexually is going to have an impact on my partner, and vice versa. including porn.

i feel that i have the right to know if my partners use porn, what they're using, how often, under what circumstances, where they're getting it, how much they have, etc. this isn't to say that i have ever interrogated anyone that way or thrown out a list of demands or anything. but if i ask, "do you watch porn?" and they get all defensive, that is a BIG red flag for me. if i know that they are into a kind of porn that really freaks me out or they use it in a way that really bothers me, and they won't discuss it with me in a rational way, the relationship probably isn't going to work out.

finding 'barely legal' porn on someone's computer would be one of those situations, especially if they refused to talk about it with me, lied about it, or refused to see my point of view about it.
pepper
once again, i differ in opinion. i don't tell my lovers/partners everything about my sex life. only the part that i choose to share with them is "ours", the rest of it, like the rest of my life, is MINE and mine alone.
take, for instance, my toys. now some of them are definitely for sharing but others are definitely NOT. i don't feel obligated to say what i like, when or why if it's personal and private and something that i like to indulge in on my own. i have secrets and i keep them to myself. i don't believe in the total intermeshing of two lives to create one. for me that wouldn't be healthy. not to say that it doesn't work for others, i know that it does. but things that i like to keep to myself, fantasies, my history before them, etc, those i am not obligated to share.
what i am trying to say is different strokes for different folks. i don't know if i even think the teen-pron is about sex life, i think it's more about morals and boundaries and impulses and control. where do we take it from there?
again i say, if someone is behaving in a way that doesn't sit right with me i either find a way to feel ok about it or i stop being around that person because making them stop the behavior doesn't take away what motivated it or made it ok in the first place. that's still there.
venetia
Pepper - oops, no I meant that some of us are allergic to some types of porn! The "wool" was the thing I was likening to porn, not the allergy!

After years of seeing this issue come up at bust I think that there's a significant number of young women who genuinely don't choose to be bothered by, or turned off by, a partner's porn use but it affects them whether they like it or not. Hence, it's a little like an allergy.
bklynhermit
pepper, i'm not saying everyone HAS to share everything (especially literally -- my toys are mine, too!).

i'm saying that, if i'm fucking someone, they're entitled to know just about everything about the rest of my 'sex life'. this has very little to do with an "entermeshing of lives" and very much to do with safety and lines of communication.

better to tell someone i've been sexually assaulted multiple times in my past than to just freak out on them if they touch me in a way that is triggering. better to ask right off the bat if someone is really into porn before i get all attached and then find out that they're into freaky hardcore shit i have a problem with. absolutely vital to inform guys i'm with that i have no intention of ever going on the pill, so it will be condoms forever.

and, conversely, i expect full disclosure from my partners as well. this isn't to be controlling or codependent, but to make an educated decision about whether i'm really interested in them, and also because just as i have things people need to know (std's, birth control issues, etc.), i would guess that a lot of people have things i would benefit from knowing, for my own personal safety and happiness. if you're one of those guys who can't enjoy sex with condoms, just TELL me rather than continuing the 'it's not you, umm, this just HAPPENS sometimes' charade. if you're one of those girls who needs her vibrator alone time, well, why not just say that? i won't be offended.

it's not about 'obligation' or control. it's not about allowing or forbidding anyone anything, or passing judgement. it's about honesty and open lines of communication. especially in the beginning, when decisions can still be made easily.
jazmyn13
bklynhermit, i don't think you heard anyone here arguing in opposition to expressing discomfort or openly talking about how you feel.

Just that some of us feel that it is overly controlling to try to say "this kind of porn is okay" and "this kind" is not (obviously excepting kiddie porn). Like, this kind of toy is okay, but this kind is not. I thnk you're right in that there needs to be accomodation and flexibility, but you have to approach each other's needs openly and non-judgementally.

I'm with pepper here. If my bf wants to know the kind of porn i watch, i'll tell him. If he doesn't want to know, or assumes i don't watch, that's fine, I don't feel an obligation to tell him. I'm not cheating on him. BUT I would have BIG problems with him telling me what I can and can't enjoy - simply because he felt it was "immoral". Either you accept me, or you don't in some areas. I would probably be more amenable to changing if it were presented in an open way, without me feeling dirty or wrong. I think that Katiebelle is right. If the situation were reversed, I thnk that we would be telling her to watch out for his trying to control her. just my 2 cents.
bklynhermit
I think we're in full agreement there then, jazmyn. I never said one should judge one's SO on the basis of whether they watch porn, never said one had the right to allow or forbid anything of that nature.

BUT i do think there should be full disclosure of that sort of thing so that people can make the proper decisions where that is concerned. I'm not interested in dating someone who devotes a significant amount of energy to pornography, has a whole lot of it, talks about it a lot, is really influenced by that whole universe. I'm just not. So I'd rather know from the beginning so that I can dump the person before things get too serious. Or so that the person in question can decide that they can live without their porn because they'd rather be with me.

I don't set out to make anyone feel dirty or wrong. I just want to be able to talk about it and express what are very real needs for me.

I also haven't wavered from my position that teen porn is NEVER ACCEPTABLE, as it's borderline illegal. There's a huge difference between 'sometimes i get off to regular garden variety porn' and 'i like something illegal'. Yes, it is wrong. Yes, I will make ANYBODY I know who is into it feel dirty and that they are doing something immoral. Because it is immoral. And they should feel dirty. Regular porn, different story (though I'm still not crazy about it). Anything where the people involved might not be 18, totally wrong. Period.
jazmyn13
well...just because they watch porn doesn't mean they're devoting a 'significant amount of energy to it' or that he talks about it at all. Obviously no one wants to date someone who's whole universe is influenced by the porn they watch. Simply watching it occasionally is completely different from the kind of "habit" you're describing. Just because I like to enjoy a drink or two occasionally doesn't mean that I'm an alcoholic. You may not want them to watch it at all; that's between you and them. If they want to do that out of care and respect for you, bully for them.

Besides, she didn't seem to indicate that his viewing was at all excessive or that it was interfering with their intimacy, just that she was bothered by what he watched - even when it was "garden variety" porn.

Also, no one is trying to get you to waiver from your stance on teen porn. you don't watch it, you wouldn't want your SO watching it. Fine. But if the participants are 18 or over, it's legal; like it or not. Unless or until the age of consent moves up, the participants are considered legal consenting adults.
jazmyn13
but basically :-) yeah, we're in agreement on the communication thing.
katiebelle2882
Bklyhermit,

you say it's not about control but frankly, that's all i see it being about. I dont think its my job to tell my SO everything about my sex life unless its relevant to OUR sex life together. It's none of his business how many people i have slept with, what i did with them etc etc. also, watching porn by myself (if it is not interfering in our sex life) has nothing to do with OUR sex life. to not keep anything to yourself about your own sexuality unless its going to be hurtful to them seems extreme and way dependent.
perhaps i feel this way because i wouldnt dump someone for watching porn as i feel its way overstepping the boundaries of personal space. perhaps expressing concern about a certain type is one thing, but telling them they can't is something else altogether. banning someone from something that is relatively harmless is a sure way to get them to go behind your back.

i am also slightly unclear as to what watching normal porn has to do with your "safety".

i think alot of women have a problem with porn bc they are insecure about themselves. I am not talking about porn that is disturbing or violent or completely degrading to women. i think a person has every right to not want their SO watching that. However if hes watching erotica or porn that portrays women fairly and you still have a problem, well i think thats something that the woman has to deal with. of course he should help, but it shouldnt impinge on his private sex life just bc you are insecure about yourself. (i dont necessarily think anyone here is like this but i am just saying).

also, i think that if someone's porn habit was as severe as you are describing Bklyn, that they wouldnt need to tell you about it, you would most likely just figure it out.

and again i will say that if this was reversed, even if the guy had reasons you do for not wanting his SO watching porn, that we would be telling her to dump the bastard bc he shoudlnt have a say in something as private as porn and what you find erotic.



pepper
kb, nice. i agree with it all except for

"i think alot of women have a problem with porn bc they are insecure about themselves."

even though i think that that is very true in many cases i think it stems from something much deeper. maybe this belongs in the f word thread but for me porn is about the degredation of women, the viewing of them as sexual objects. i think it effects us all, each one of us, male and female, on a subconscious level. look at the pronogrification of teeny weeny grade school kids these days. it's the trickle down effect of making sexuality nothing special, or all that there is.
i'm not insecure, i'm hot and i'm dirty. the thing is i only want the man i'm with thinking about me that way, not every dude who ever sees me. and that's what porn is all about to me. it's not the simple watching of erotic images. those girls don't even look real anymore. it's not like puffy bush 70's porn is all the rage these days. oh no, these days girls that are still in grade school want surgery to make them more "perfect".
i choose to not feed into that crap by not supporting the industry and seeing it for all that it is. if i wanna watch porn, i'll make my own.

this isn't very eloquently put but i'm tired, it's been a long day.
bklynhermit
i don't have a problem with porn because i'm insecure about myself. i have a problem with porn because for three years i dated someone who was basically addicted to the stuff.

let's see. we could start with when he told me he was going to dump me because i was 'fat' and 'unnatractive when naked' -- i weighed about 115 lbs. at the time and every other partner i've ever had, before or since, has had no problem with my body. however, i don't look like a porn star therefore i am 'fat' and 'unnattractive'.

we could then go to the way he was fixated only on porn-ish sex acts. all of his fantasies, EVERY SINGLE THING he wanted to do in bed was centered around cliche porn stuff: from behind, deep throat, anal, S&M, cumming on my chest. he never ever wanted to do anything in bed that he hadn't already seen in porn a zillion times. incidentally, this also meant that he had virtually no interest in pleasuring me in any genuine way, and that if i didn't have loud rapturous orgasms all the time (despite having sex that was in no way pleasurable for me) he would accuse me of being an ungrateful cunt or taking his totally hot sexual prowess for granted.

then there were all the times he wanted me to watch porn that he knew specifically made me uncomfortable. rape, hardcore s&m, gang bangs, girls physically in pain choking on cock. and if i refused, he would wait till i was in bed to blare the porn i'd refused to watch and then loudly get off to it.

this is why i 'have a problem' with porn. because i've seen the guys who are really into it, and they're fucked up. because i hate the kinds of sex and attitudes towards women's bodies it promotes. and, yeah, because of all the classic feminist arguments, too.

i dont' hate porn because i'm insecure, i hate it because i'm confident enough in myself to honestly know that porn isn't what sex is supposed to be about, and i don't want it in my sex life.

which means, yes, i'm willing to dump someone if they seem too into it for me. and, yes, i want to know whether my partners use it a lot. it's not about codependence or control. i have a right to know what makes my partner tick, sexually. and if it's something that disturbs me, i have a right to not want to be with that person. had i known all the ramifications of that previous partner's interest in porn, i would have broken up with him before i got in over my head. it would very much have been a matter of my safety - mental and emotional safety, perhaps, but even so.
greenbean
yeesh, well, that senario is def bad news!
I actually liked that my former boyfriends were into porn, but none of them acted the way bklyn described. I guess its all about how they feel about/treat women irl, because I dont think you can generalize everyone who looks at porn (which is basically everyone).

In regards to the "school girl" porn, I dont have a big problem with it because one of my friends has posed for barely legal porn (when she was 22 and looked 16) and really, they are VERY careful to make sure those girls are of age. As far as it not being healthy to like girls that look young, well, thats kinda of a double standard. I mean, most Busties would applaud a large women seen as a sex object, yet a flat-chested girl with small teeth cant be seen as sexy? Doesnt seem fair.
katiebelle2882
yeah, just to clarify, I didnt think thats why you had an issue with porn bklyn, and yes pepper, i would say that many women have an issue bc it does portray women in a horrible light (but not all of it). Of course bklyn, if i had a guy like that, i wouldnt like porn either, but its hardly the majority.

This all being said, I have an issue with porn as well, I was just speaking from the angle of the fact that i wouldnt tell my SO what to watch (as long as it wasnt fucked up, or turned into a situation that you experienced brklyn.)

Also, there is such thing as women friendly porn that even guys enjoy watching. I agree pepper that it very much could stem from what you explained (no need to go into it again you did a very nice job yourself)

greenbean, i agree with your assessment that many of us here would applaud a big woman being looked at as a sex object but kind of belittle those who are small. that being said, i think the idea is that society at large already affirms that being tiny and skinny is a good thing, while bigger women dont see that kind of reinforcement in society.
greenbean
I see what yer saying, katie, and I suppose this is the age-old feminist debate about porn: can you enjoy mainstream porn AND be a feminist? I've always felt conflicted about it because I myself DO enjoy porn thats made for dudes, as opposed to the women-friendly variety, yet I feel like that means I'm not a good feminist. Same with being skinny, I always feel scorn from other feminists like I'm "part of the problem" and its like "hey! I was born this way I cant help it!"
...anyway, sorry for the derail...back to advice for badcrumble, I say by all means let your dude know what type of porn bothers you, but I think you shouldnt judge him simply for looking at porn, because its only natural. When things start to sound like bklyn's ex, then its time to bolt.

by the way, where are you, badcrumble?
jazmyn13
hey greenebean, i'm with you. I enjoy watching porn that perhaps some others on this board wouldn't enjoy. I have struggled with it, as well as my own enjoyment of darker kinds of sexual behavior. I'm still not entirely sure what it means that I enjoy all that and still consider myself a strong feminist. That's why i might seem a little too sensitive about people judging other people's sexual fantasies and practices.
katiebelle2882
Yes jazmyn, i have a serious problem when feminists start saying "you are a self hating woman" or "you have been socialized to like that porn and to enjoy being hurt during sex". yeah, i dont think its that easy. i would think that especially as an enlightened feminist, you have thought about it, know the implications, and still enjoy whatever you enjoy, even if some may call it misogynist. i dont think feminism should be about making women feel guilty, or even lie, about what they find erotic.
pepper
perhaps i HAVE been socialized to like being hurt during sex. my mother was in an abusive relationship and so was i, all through my twenties. taking control over that aspect of my sex life is a valid form of self healing. end of story.
and perhaps we have been socialized to enjoy porn. lord knows it's out there in the mainstream these days. it uses evocative sexual imagery that ilicits a response from the primal reptilian brain. that is some hard shit to resist and i'm not saying that i don't get aroused when i see it, hell i've made my own porn and LOVE having a mirror in the bedroom. it's not about the imagery itself, it's about the psychology of it. it might turn me on while i'm looking at it (providing it isn't the ridiculous fakey fake-ass too-silly-to-even-pretend-it's-sexy sort), it's how i feel afterwards. that shit is abusive and it makes me feel sick. i too had a bf like the sick fucker described below and i have a hard time believing that he would have gotten that way without society telling him that that sort of pornographic depiction of women and sex was "normal" and something to strive for. it fed his addiction, justified it and made him righteous about being as sick as he was. just 'cause some people can deal with it in a healthy way doesn't mean we all can, and therein lies the heart of the issue, i think. it's just like alcohol and cigarettes, they're legal and even considered ok by lots and lots of people. they still fuck up lives though and because they are considered maintream a blind eye is most often turned to all that fucked-up-ness. not to say that i won't have a glass of wine now and then, i just won't glamourize the practice of getting and being shitfaced like it's "cool".
i enjoy erotica, but i won't feed into a massively disfunctional industry. not with my acceptance and support, and certainly not with my money.
katiebelle2882
maybe for you, but i dont think its fair to sit there and say that every instance of a woman liking a certain type of porn is her internalizing her oppression.
i also think that the majority of people are not like the boyfriend bklyn had.
pepper
i think that maybe being accepting of what that sort of normalization of perversion does to our society is an internalization of oppresion. how can we think that it's ok for teeny weenies to want to be so outrageously sexy? but we do, as a culture, as a society, we are VERY accepting of that. it comes from somewhere, from the normalization of something that is not normal at all. just sayin'.

i don't think anyone is "wrong" for getting turned on by sexual images, like i said, it targets a very primitive portion of the brain. it's how we're getting there that bothers me.
pepper
one more thing, i wanted to point out that those generalizations are not meant to be taken as personally as you are seeming to. you know your own motivation, no one can tell you what that is. the arguement is about the issue as a whole.
katiebelle2882
no no, i am not taking it personally, i was just pointing out that while surely people DO internalize their oppression, i dont think that can be the case for everyone, or even most people, especially if you are aware of that oppresion to begin with. but who knows really.
maddy29
Pepper-well said!!!! "i don't think anyone is "wrong" for getting turned on by sexual images, like i said, it targets a very primitive portion of the brain. it's how we're getting there that bothers me."
jazmyn13
I have certainly never been abused or molested, so i'm starting to accept that my taste for more fringe kinds of sexual practices (that aren't really that fringe in my opinion, i'm not visiting leather bars or getting whipped or anything like that) and fantasies is just part of who i am. is some of it societal? probably. But our society is schitzophrenic about sex. There are highly sexual and exploitative images while there is also an extremely high premium placed on virginity, purity, and convention. If someone were really uptight about sex, one could argue that was the result of socialization as well.

I think that i know what sparked my interest, but that's for a different thread and it was most assuredly not violent or coercive in any way.

whew...we kinda got off topic didn't we? ex-bf update...

He called last week to "congratulate" me when he found out i was moving out of town. He said "i guess this is really it, we're never going to see each other again" and "were you even going to call me to say goodbye" and other shit like that. Gah. the whole conversation made me realize how manipulative he was. Then he tried to blame me for the end of the relationship and when i was fair and even tempered and calm, picked a fight over a "missing" camcorder that I returned to him before we broke up. We ended up viciously fighting. It was completely a non sequiter and he totally did it because I was making too much sense and he wasn't getting a rise out of me. idiot. i ended the call because it was going in circles and it wasn't worth staying on. but damn, why did he have to go and do that??? i was being perfectly nice and friendly. He just doesn't understand I don't want to be friends right now. He was hurt I didn't invite him to my bbq two weeks ago!

I am honestly surprised at how far i've moved on in one month. I felt so strongly for him and was so caught up in the drama of our relationship for so long, that it is strange to feel so...completely fine. I've got so muhc more to think about than what he's doing or saying or thinking. and that's a real relief. Even my libido has simmered down! which is great because normally i'd feel like i was climbing the walls after a couple of weeks.

the only bad thing is that it makes me wonder how true my feelings really were while we were together. Now, from the outside, I almost can't imagine why I wanted to marry this person and spend my life with him. I have so much to do yet in my life..."oh the places you'll go" and all that. A month and a half ago, I was breaking apart because i was losing him! Was I decieving myself??? were my emotions real? I know i'm not ready to really get into any sort of serious relationship with someone else, but i've already got a fairly serious flirtation with a guy and have actually been on a couple of dates with him. I just have so much fun with this new guy, it's all shiny and relaxed and new. He's sweet and nice and cute and successful and funny!

was I lying to my ex about my emotions? I don't think that i was, i can remember that deep deep tenderness and happiness I felt at spending time with him and doing little couple things, but it's at a remove, it doesn't feel immediate anymore. Thinking of him is only occasionally painful and for the first time, I really and truly hope that he is happy in his life, whatever he does and whoever he is with.

am i moved on? i don't know yet...
jazmyn13
oops... i thought we were in the mooooving on thread....haha! sorry folks.
saktii
HELP! This is going to be loooonnnggg, but I need some advice...
So, before getting together with my boyfriend, he had a long-distance casual relationship with a girl in Seattle. Apparently, the girl thought the relationship was more serious than he did (according to him, he always made it very clear to her that it was never going to go anywhere) and became VERY upset when she found out that he had a new GF (me).
This girl happens to be a mutual friend of my boyfriend's best friend who is getting married next weekend in Washington DC.
A few weeks ago, the about-to-be married couple had a three day long rave on the beach in celebration of the pending nuptuials. It had been prearranged for months that the girl from Seattle was going to stay at my BF's house.
He was very nervous about having to have "the talk" with her and about trying to keep the situation civil so as not to ruin his friend's wedding celebrations with unnecessary drama. My bf did not want me to meet this girl, because he thought meeting me would just rub in the hurt for her and make matters worse.
I was okay with this, and the situation since then was left at "She seems to think I led her on, which I didn't and she's very hurt, but civil."
NOW, I find out that this girl will be staying at his house again for 2 days before they fly out to the wedding in DC together. (Once again, prearranged before I came into the picture).
I was trying to be okay with it, until I found a letter that she had written him around the time of the beach party.
The gist of the letter was that she seems to think (I'm not sure if she's delusional or if it's based on what he said to her) that the only reason they're not together is that she lives too far away, and that he ran away from her because the depth of his feelings for her scared him.
This is HIGHLY unsettling to me, especially considering the fact that he claims to be in love with me. Now I'm just worried that he's with me because I happen to be geographically more convenient for him.
I feel, that given the situation, it is ENTIRELY INAPPROPRIATE for this girl to be staying in his house again.
I'm considering demanding to meet her, or offering to pay for her to stay in a hotel. If he can do neither of these things for me, then my belief that this girl really doesn't mean so much to him will be highly compromised, and I'll feel like a little secret he wishes to have kept tucked away.
I'm just so confused right now. I understand that he doesn't want to do anything that will damage his friend's wedding, but I just happen to think that I need to put my foot down somewhere, in order to really be able to trust what he's told me about this situation.
Advice? Please?
amilita
Yeah, I think your instincts are right, saktii. I'm not sure what, exactly, I'd ask your boyfriend to do. The facts are, however, that he's doing all these things to spare her feelings, but now you are having bad feelings, so his obligation is to you, not her.

I think you could start a conversation with your boyfriend about the letter, and how you're no longer comfortable with the upcoming arrangements. You could even ask him for solutions to start with, as opposed to making specific demands.

Good luck.
sybarite
Saktii, I agree with amilita. Have a conversation rather than demanding outright that she stay elsewhere. I understand your response and think it's a sensible one, but I do think he's trying to clean up a situation that existed before you entered his life.

Um, I once was that girl. I was seeing someone and because it was never formalised as a relationship (or not for very long) he began seeing someone else while I still believed we were on a hiatus. Then me and half-ex went on a prearranged holiday, much to her disgust. Despite spending a week with each other he never touched me. At the time I was livid he hadn't been straight with me (as was she I expect) and he has since admitted he fucked up royally. I'm mentioning this as an example of how things can spiral when they're not talked about... but also to illustrate that his intentions could easily be good, and he simply hasn't clarified things enough with her out of fear of hurting her feelings. Which is weak, but fixable.

Good luck, hope things resolve themselves soon.
saktii
Thanks guys! I talked to him, and he's deathly afraid of doing anything to make the wedding uncomfortable for his friend, but agreed that it was perfectly reasonable and appropriate that he ask her to stay in a hotel.
I love him very much, but oh-- the thing about the truly good ones is that they don't realize that sometimes being cold is kinder when it comes to letting a person down.
I do feel bad for the girl, I do-- I've been in her shoes before, but I think it's terribly selfish of her to assume that she can stay at his house after all of this.
_octinoxate
Hi all. Has anyone here ever tried couples' counseling? I ask because my boyfriend and I of five months (though off and on for years) are having some serious troubles lately that we can't seem to get over on our own. There are a lot of factors at play, but one good way to sum it up is that we have very different approaches to relationships, which always leaves him feeling hurt and unappreciated, and leaves me feeling stifled and guilty. I think we may need a third party to help us work on some compromises, communication, etc. What could we expect from a couples' counselor (assuming I could convince him to see one with me)?
halcyon
Octinoxate,
Couples' counseling can help, but a lot of it depends on how you and he react to the situation. My ex and I went to couples' counseling (at CAPS at UA, in fact) and it was good for me, but he just sat there like a bump on a log. It's really dependent on both of you contributing to the session. So if you two are both into it and committed to working with the situation, it'll probably be quite worthwhile. Actually, I could probably recommend someone for you to see there...good luck!
koala
okay guys.... i've got a question for you....

My boy and i have been dating for 4 years now. When we first started dating, i made alot of mistakes (being inconsiderate, but never cheating) and didn't really know too much about being in a long term relationship. I have grown alot in this relationship and I think I am a much better partner. I also think that he would totally agree. The thing is.... every once in a while, he'll think about something i did in our earlier days and it will put him in this total funk and he gets upset. I don't know how to respond and he tells me theres nothing i can do since the event happened in the past. I hate that these issues still come up like this. I know I messed up and I understand that his feelings were hurt and I understand why. I feel like I could be a 100% perfect girlfriend and et this stuff would come up. I wich he wouldn't dwell on these things. What do I do? I'm totally lost.
pepper
oh mercy, koala, if he chooses to be an emotional ruin over some ancient history my advice is to LET HIM. this is not your issue girl, even though it originated with something that you did. that transaction is completed, you apologized and he forgave it and it's over. him being miserable over it is his choice to make and i would just let him stew in that until he got over it if i were you. i don't mean be a bitch or anything but gently let him know that you feel that he needs to be left alone with that issue to deal with it. if he needs to talk to you about it then you're there for him but for him to continue to hang it over your head and punish you for it makes it into something horrible that he's doing to you, not about something that you did at all.
what's worse, the thing you did one time long ago or him making himself and you feel like dirt about it over and over again?
may i recommend a book? it's called loving what is by byron katie and it deals in part with this very issue. it's one of my favourites, and that's saying something.
mistakes are how we learn. it's hard to get very far without them and that makes me grateful for every single one i've ever made. i've learned a lot.
_octinoxate
Halcyon, thanks for the input. I might get in touch with you a little later to get that counselor recommendation... but unfortunately I don't think UA couples' counseling will work out, because my guy doesn't live here in AZ and it looks like couples' counseling is only offered as a set program in fall semester. I don't know if we have the financial resources to go find a counselor outside the university. So, I guess we're on our own for now. How unfortunate. Thanks again though for your input.
sweetn_low
hey busties, i just need a girlfriend to talk to, and usually my mom fills those shoes but i can't talk to her about sex for some reason...basically though i feel shitty...

ok, so i *just* got back from my bf's. we've been together about a month so it's a pretty new relationship. so anyway, i just got back and the thing is i missed him all day while i was at work and when i went over to his place afterwards we just chilled out, listened to some records and had "sweet passionate sex" as he calls it, basically the really sweet kind. god, i sound like a moron, i know. anyway, like *right* afterwards his roomate and best friend both started knocking on the door and shit, wanting him to come out and drink. so they teased us alittle about it and then i decided i should probably go home b/c i just didn't want to deal w/ ppl. u know what i mean?!? i just wanted to fucking HANG OUT WITH MY FUCKING BOYFRIEND. so he dropped me off and i just felt like my privacy was invaded. i mean, it's alittle bizarr when his roomate is sitting on the couch with a pillow on his lap after you and your bf just had sex, isn't it?????? so i sat here and ate chocolate trying not to let things bother me b/c i know i'm over sensitive anyway so i try to be cool, u know? well, my bf called and asked if i was mad or anything b/c he felt like i was *tense* on the ride home and i said "no, blah blah, i'm fine.." and then after hanging up i felt even more aweful. he didn't have to drink fucking beers w/ them he could have just chilled w/ me, at least until the fucking sheets cooled. so, i don't feel good about myself right now and i just blame myself b/c i should have just said, "uh...dumbass, what about me?!?"....round and round i go. i'd rather be angery than feel sad but i hate being angery. fuck man. and i also wonder if he still has some sort of feelings for his ex, he seems touchy about it. when am i going to get the balls to bring this shit up? this guy is way to good to me to play games with him but i feel like operating in a straight forward manner is so much harder. wtf?!?

can i just have a shoulder to cry on plz? and i know my post doesn't make alot of sense and if any of you were able to decode my meaning behind the hysteria, ~thankyou~.
saktii
Sweetn,
you know, guys seem to be much less shy about sex than women. You have a right to be angry, but communicating your feelings to him is the only way to make sure he knows better next time.
saktii
I've also been wondering if it's too soon to approach my boyfriend with the idea of moving in together.
We've only been together 3 or 4 months, but it just so happens that we both need to move out of our respective apartments at the same time.
I live in a city where it can be VERY difficult to find a home that's a)affordable b) will take cats c) not with crazy san francisco wingnut types.
I just feel like it would be more sensible if he and I just found a place together, but I'm not sure if it's too soon.
karma77
Saktii, I was recently battling with the same dilemma. My boyfriend of 5 months and I spend an incredible amount of time together at my house (like 5 nights a week on average), yet he has his own apartment. We have both talked about wanting to find roommates lately, but it occured to me that we could live together and forget the idea of roommates.

I was a bit nervous about bringing the idea up this soon, but when I did last week, he told me he had been thinking of the same, but was waiting for me to suggest it (as it is my house we will live in). We both agreed that we feel we know each other very well, and that we are ready for the next step. He is probably moving in within the next month or two, and we are both very happy!

I think the best advice is to gage it according to how you feel about the relationship, and be clear on your intentions and reasons for living together. I was clear with my bf that I don't want to look at this like a temporary roommate situation, but as a deeper committment in our relationship. If it's more of a financial / convenience reason, that's a good reason too, but I think that no matter what, both parties need to be clear. I learned the hard way about that a couple years ago. Good luck!
appmtnwoman
Hey lovely ladies. I'm new here, and I need a bit of advice.
I met the man I'm now engaged to (Cade) when I was away at college. I'm home for the summer,and we live six hours apart. Neither of us are phone people, so it feels like we're not really connecting in that way. How do I stay close emotionally and keep things heated up when I feel disconnected because of the physical difference?
karma77
Satkii, another thing I wanted to mention is that it really is not about the length of time you have been together. Rather, it is about the amount of time you spend together, and the quality of that time.

Some things I thought about were: Do I feel closer to him as time goes on? Do I miss him when he is not around? Does he annoy me at all? I think a few months is enough time to answer these questions for many couples.
pepper
appmtnwoman, have you introduced yourself in the newbies thread? if you haven't why dontcha head on over there and say hello.
just wanted to let you know that your email addy is visible in your profile, you can click the edit profile link on the left of this screen and select the option to hide your email. that way no one can just google it and read everything you've written here. i avoid using the real names of people i'm discussing too, don't know if that's important to you but it sure makes me feel safe if i want to post something really personal.

i had a long distance relationship for over a year and realized that i had to make some effort to keep the flame alive. even if you don't like the phone much you could still just call now and then to tell him that you've been thinking about him. a two minute call full of endearments won't go amiss every once in a while. i also sent mail. sounds silly but a nice handwritten letter or goofy postcard telling him something funny that happened or just about my day, i sent pictures too. and i emailed little bits of gossip, recipes i thought he'd like, pictures, and dirty stories i made up. anything to make him (and myself) feel that we were still a part of eachother's daily lives, to keep a presence in his mind and deeds and make him aware of how much i loved him regardless of the space.
long distance relationships do sometimes require more effort because you aren't there to communicate energetically. you have to decide how much it's worth to you effort wise.
pepper
saktii, the one question i ask of living with a partner is "do i like his space?"
if he's a slob or has ick furniture or habits i know that i'll want to throw him out a window before long. those little things of daily life can become enormous after prolonged exposure.
jazmyn13
hey all...

sweetnlow, and ladies, I think that it is never ever a good idea to lie about how you are feeling. When you tell your bf that everything is "fine" that you're not mad, when you are - you're lying to him! If you tell him that everything is fine, he's going to think okay, everything is fine. Which will make it even more frustrating and confusing for him when you finally blow up at him, hours or days later.

communicate communicate. it's not fair to him or to yourself to do anything else. He's not a mind reader, you didn't say you wanted to hang out longer. You could have gone out with them, but you chose not to ask if that was an option. I used to do all this to my ex-bf and it drove him crazy (rightfully). I found that the best thing to say when he asks if you're alright and you're trying to figure out if you should really be upset about something is "I'm not sure, I'm trying to figure out how I'm feeling". That's at least honest.
appmtnwoman
Pepper,
Thanks for both the relationship advice and the board advice. I'm new to boards like this and don't know the in and outs of using them/safety tips yet.

I found a book called "Questions for Couples" online last night, and started reading "1001 Ways to Say I Love You." Here are some cute things I nabbed that we can all use for relationships, both long distance and live-in:
-Cut out comic strips from the sunday paper that remind you of your other, and put it in an envelope or on the fridge (Cathy works best for me...)
-You can go to Walmart.com's photo section and make a puzzle out of a picture with you and your other, and attach a note that says something cute along the lines of, "Only you can put my pieces together..."
-find cute lingerie you can buy online, get it, and send him a picture of what you're going to wear for him later while he's away or on the clock (just not to his work email, bad idea...)
lilacwine13
Hey all, I don't know where else to post this, but I need some advice.

AZ Guy and I have lived together for almost a year, and it's been rather rocky. Lately things have smoothed out, but I'm still concerned. Today, when I was getting his laptop out (I use his computer because I don't have one and yes, he's okay with it.), I found a condom.

I'm on the Pill and we haven't used condoms since last July.

I'm not sure if I should confront him about this, or if I should just let it slide. We both agreed to be monogamous, and I know he's had issues about this in the past, but I thought we resolved them and things were going to be fine. Also, I'm not sure how to confront him about this. I am sure he's going to blame me for everything because hey, I was the one who wants to be in this (even though both of us have wanted out over the past year), and right now I really don't want to hear that bullshit. I'm really at a loss of what to do, and would appreciate any suggestions.
pepper
are you serious? you don't know whether to say anything or not? crazy. if you are anything at all like me this will bug your forever, even long after the two of you are over, if you ever split up. i'd speak right up girl, i wouldn't accuse or trip or anything, i'd just say "hey, today when i was getting your laptop out i found a condom. we haven't used them since july and, well... uh. is it from before or do you want to talk to me about something? i trust you to tell me the truth and whatever you tell me i'll believe. but i couldn't just find it and not say anything."
there, pretty straight forward and sure to lead to some kind of answer. either he just missed it being in there for the past almost year or he "forgot" about it in a place that he subconsiously knew you'd find it. either way, i'd have to know.
venetia
I agree with Pepper. There actually could be a rational explanation for it, anyway (eg my bf always eagerly accepts the free samples to stock up for the times when I have to take antibiotics or miss a pill or if he has a yeast infection.)

It's noat a matter of having a confrontation so much as one of keeping the communication channels open, like Jazmyn said below.
stillveryangry
lilac, if he would give you shit about bringing it up, he's a manipulative jerk. You shouldnt have to put up with that shit.
maimy
Here's hoping it's something as simple as the possibility he knows that, say, if you went on antibiotics, backups are required. It could happen. But asking is the only way to know. Good luck, Lilac!
maude
lilacwine13,

You should definitely be open and ask him directly about it. It's your right as his partner to know why there is a condom when you as a couple don't use them.
If you don't ask a direct question you cannot know the answer. And letting it slide is something only people who are afraid of the truth do.
And don't look at it as a confrontation, which sounds like war from the get go.
Look at it as an honest inquiry. Decide about confrontation after you get the answer, or excuse whichever he tells you. In your gut you'll know anyway.

Good luck
pepper
hmm, in your gut you might Already know anyway.
wait, was that morbid? gah, i can't be trusted to give relationship advice right now...
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