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thepointybird
QUOTE(auralpoison @ May 18 2009, 02:06 PM) *
See, I have this terrible fear that my kid would be devoid of freak flag. Like the weird might skip a generation & I'd end up with some boring foreign creature that would shy away from mama's teachings of good stuff for her generation's Jonas Brothers, Twilight, & High School Musical.


You might have a Saffie! Hahaa! But yes, it's another thing I've always wondered - what if you had kids and actually just didn't really like them very much? As people?
pollystyrene
QUOTE(auralpoison @ May 18 2009, 08:06 AM) *
See, I have this terrible fear that my kid would be devoid of freak flag. Like the weird might skip a generation & I'd end up with some boring foreign creature that would shy away from mama's teachings of good stuff for her generation's Jonas Brothers, Twilight, & High School Musical.


Have you heard the Patton Oswalt sketch (from Werewolves & Lollipops) about being afraid that his future child will be a jock or something, and is going to throw all of his action figures on the roof (Patton's action figures, not the kid's own action figures)? It's pretty funny. There's a lot of CBC content in that whole show.

I think I'm also afraid I'd have a boy- I'd so much rather have a girl than a boy, and if I had a boy, I'd have to make the "to circumcise or not to circumcise?" decision and that's just too much for me.
auralpoison
It's just like, what if my kid sucks?

I went to school with a girl that was little miss dynamic. She did *everything*. She was a clogdancer of all things. Which was cool & all, but her mom was like, her personal chauffer, cheerleader, etc, etc. Could I stomach such lame shit for my kid? Or would I be like my parents & not attend anything that happened before seven pm?

I am not down with the circumcision. My imaginary son has his imaginary foreskin & he knows how to imaginarily clean it.
pollystyrene
I fall on the "not to circumcise" side of the fence, too, but like I said in my earlier post, we're lazy. I'd like to think that "it's different when it's your kid" and I'd find the time, energy and motivation to deal with foreskin maintenance, but there are times when I can't even be bothered to shove a pill down my dog's throat before I go to bed (don't worry, it won't kill him to miss a dose or anything).
bunnyb
I'm too selfish, end of discussion. I wouldn't have time for me, to read a book, to chill with my boy, to watch TV shows and movies, to go to the cinema or anywhere else whenever we wanted, to travel. I value my free time too much and cherish the time spent with the boy. I may like Seuss but I would not be willing to read only Seuss (and other picture books) for 5 years and be deprived of literature. Yes, I'm a bit book mad.

I also can't handle the thought of having to be around other children and their parents and have to pretend to be a cheery, sunny, individual. I don't do child-speak either.

I also don't do patience. Just shit in the fucking potty already.

Like polly, I need my fucking sleep, and if I don't get enough and don't have the opportunity to nap, I am a complete fiend. Lack of sleep every night would put me over the edge; I would be one of those tragic cases you read about in newspaper articles "sleep-deprived mother drowns baby in bath."

There is a fifteen year age difference between myself and my younger sister, who has a lot of issues. I worry that it is genetic; I couldn't live the life my mother does.

I haven't had any childhood diseases (except for mumps) and having children would increase my chances of contracting them as an adult.
doodlebug
Even when I was a little girl, I could see for myself the unfair burden of home and family on women. I just knew I didn't want to do it. I wanted to save the world, like Wonder Woman! wink.gif And also, I wanted to pursue the arts. It seemed incompatible with this 24 hour burden of children. Artist's NEED alone time.
turbojenn
I am *loving* this discussion! AP & Polly, thank you for bringing me a good laugh - douchebaby - too funny! And imaginarily clean weenies....you ladies are awesome. This thread is so excellent!
humanist77
Totally creepy PostSecret from this week, but I couldn't resist sharing :D
pollystyrene
That one was really creepy- I think it needs a warning on it, because it's pretty startling!

Basically, it's a picture of a baby where they photoshopped Mr. Bean's face onto the baby's face, and it says "I'm terrified of having children!" Yeah, I'd be terrified too if they came out looking like that!
auralpoison
He is a hipster douchebaby, Turbojenn! He is!

These two parents are straight cool kids. There isn't a single thing in their lives that isn't cool. Every item's design/function has been thought out for maximum awesomeness. Their pot holders are fantastic, their toilet paper dispenser is irreverent, their curtains are made of some 'mysteriously found' fabric designed by some really obscure, brilliant designer from the mid-fifties that they of course got a jump on & got dirt cheap before anybody else knew about her. So naturally, they have the world's coolest baby, too. Their FB updates are always something like, "Douchebaby demanded more product in his hair this morning. He gots to have his hair did!" or "We picked up the new dog from the shelter today & asked Douchebaby what he wanted to name him. Douchebaby said, "D. Boon"! Can you believe that? LOL!" or "Douchebaby was pouting because mommy & daddy forgot to tivo the Mighty Boosh. sad.gif".
sybarite
No disrespect to your pals AP, but *gag*
p_176
delurking for a minute to whine about people who try to *tell* you when you're going to have kids. my sister, who has a kid (unplanned), was excited that my guy and i are moving in together soon, buying a house, and will get married probably in the next year. then she said, i bet you'll be pregnant in a year. i said, no *maybe* two years but definitely not one year. she got a little upset, because she's (more than 50lb overweight), when i (~50lbs overweight) said that i had to lose weight and get my blood sugar under control before i even think about getting pregnant. for now, condoms are it - childfree by choice and practice. if we change our minds, fine, if not, fine. i think people with children want people without children to have children, so they'll suffer too. but, like, if you wanted kids, then why are you whining about the life changes that come with it - you were aware that would happen right....<end rant>
humanist77
oh god, I love The Onion!
sybarite
Humanist, I love the way he tells his 4 year old brat that he is going to 'seriously regret [his] choices today.' Who the hell says things like this to their small child, and expect them to understand what it means??
turbojenn
Bwahahaha! I love coming in here and reading about Douchebaby! Thanks for giving me a laugh, AP!! "douchebaby needs his hair did..." LAME. But funny as hell to read about!
thepointybird
I have to say that 'Hipster Douchebaby' is going to be my new favourite insult. Applied to the adult hipsters that I seem to trip over on a daily basis.
girltrouble
i'm right there with you, pointy bird. whenever a hipster whines now, i don't think i'll be able to resist saying that the "hipster douchebaby needs a diaper change."
thepointybird
Hipster Douchbaby's throwing his toys out of the pram!
culturehandy
I called someone a hipster douchebaby yesterday!!!! I love it.
girltrouble
i think hipster douchebaby should be this thread's imaginary child.

i'm not taking care of HDB. if he wants baby food, he can make it himself. and while he's at it he needs to get a job. wink.gif
auralpoison
QUOTE(thepointybird @ May 22 2009, 08:07 AM) *
Hipster Douchbaby's throwing his toys out of the pram!


No, no, Hipster Douchebaby threw his repro limited edition Steve Austin the Six Million Dollar Man action figure (With telescopic eye!) out of his Skelanimals printed pram with iPod dock & speakers. Playing the latest Grizzly Bear, natch. Thank god nanny Frances Coco Bean caught Steve because if HDB had realized he'd lost it, not even a trip to Aquarius Records would have consoled him. Mommy would have had to break down & buy him that Scott Pilgrim t shirt he wants so very badly!

QUOTE(girltrouble @ May 22 2009, 10:28 AM) *
i think hipster douchebaby should be this thread's imaginary child.

i'm not taking care of HDB. if he wants baby food, he can make it himself. and while he's at it he needs to get a job. wink.gif


As long as he's imaginarily uncircumcised & can imaginarily clean his peen, I say it's an imaginary go.

As far as a job goes, I think he may be spinning before Sam Ronson's set at Roe. He'd like to turn that into a regular night somewhere. A pastiche of obscure R&B from the 50-70s, some hardcore, Swiss porn soundtracks, classic country, David Bowie, 80s hair metal, bubble gum pop, & Gregorian chant to wind up last call. A once a month art show kicking off with sippy cups decorated/designed by fifty of the area's artistic up & comers, maybe a lemonade stand. He wants it to be slick metro-mod & studded proto-rocker & all Douchebaby. Call it Binky. No trucker hats allowed & you better not be wearing your girlfriend's jeans!
humanist77
I've totally been calling people douchebabies the last couple days in my head, left and right. I will proudly deem someone aloud if the appropriate opportunity comes!
girltrouble
aural, HDB just emailed about about binky. he says old music is passe. he says he's programed his original speak and spell to read random twitters mashed up with vocalized clips from iran's version of 'high school musical' and progressive insurance commercials .

as for the unnipped peen, business, HDB told me (while putting on some new mac lipgloss and eyeliner) that dirty is "the new black" and even refuses to change his nappy and that you shouldn't expect anything like that from him, that, he said, was how he got to be douchebaby #1. what's more, he insists he poops strawberry-kiwi lime "mr. smoothie" soft serve.
auralpoison
Goddamn you, Hipster Douchebaby. Goddamn you!
girltrouble
seriously.


what a douchebaby.









....so....
....you going to binky?


ETA: HDB insisted that i correct my post. he poops soft serve from, "pinkberry, NOT mr. smoothie. god", he said, "mr. smoothie is worse than saying 'jamba juice!' nobody eats there."
*sigh*



(speaking of douchebabies, although not the hipster variety, mary kay le tourneau and her hubby/boy toy played a gig last night, dubbed "hot for teacher night". i guess the boy is a dj....)
culturehandy
totally OT,

but the cure for the blues lies with the hilarious banter between AP and GT.
prophecy_grrl
sorry to interrupt the Hipster Douche Baby flow here wink.gif , but I found this very amusing: Breeder Bingo. See, you get to cover a square for each cliche a breeder has spewed when you tell them you don't plan on reproducing. It's a few years old, sorry if it's been posted before.
stargazer
Good one, prophecy! laugh.gif

I'm not Cameron Diaz's biggest fan, but, it was good to read her view of being childfree.
sassy
Per the breeding bingo, "Children are a women's greatest achievement." I've actually had someone say that to me. It took all my strength not to hit them. mad.gif
girltrouble
that's true-- for the women she knows.


...she just knows the wrong women.
pollystyrene
QUOTE(prophecy_grrl @ Apr 9 2009, 10:27 AM) *
I very much have a love-hate relationship with Oprah, so I think a deconstructing Oprah thread would be tres cool. As for yesterday's episode, I loathe that Gary Neuman guy. Every time he is on the show, it's about how women emasculate men (he did the one about how when men cheat, it's because their wives emasculate them and don't put out enough).


A little off-topic from CBC, but I thought y'all would be interested- the cover story in Newsweek this week is a very interesting article about Oprah's poor track record of recommending medical procedures. They say Dr. Oz and Bob Greene have pretty solid advice, but she has all these wackadoos on (Suzanne Somers, Jenny McCarthy, as well as quack doctors, etc.) who she never questions and doesn't have any other guests to counter their theories. Some of the advice has been flat-out wrong (some doctor who said that women who think they have a thyroid problem should just self-medicate with iodine supplements- uh, no!) and some of it has just been misleading (like some radio wave skin treatment thing she went nuts about a few years ago, but neglected to mention how some people aren't candidates for it and there's a high incidence of excruciating pain) but it's a very good article. Oh, and they go into the craziness of The Secret, too (that always sounded like a load of Scientology bullshit to me.)

Back to CBC....

LOL, gt- I'll have to use that line next time someone tells me that children would be my greatest accomplishment. dry.gif
stargazer
Polly, I think Oprah's failings on alternative and complimentary medicine is that she does not present enough data or evidence practice to support this type of medicine. I share some of beliefs of the "quack" doctors. However, science has been working hard to supporting evidence for eastern medicine which has been long pegged some form of black magic. I think the article was correct that Oprah does not allow for deferring opinions. Also, I should mention that believe in the law of attraction and like attracts like. I think if I didn't follow this belief pattern then I wouldn't have met you or the other Chicago busties.

Sorry to contribute to the derailment.

Sassy, I often feel the same way.
missladyj
the "law of attraction" is not a law in the scientific sense and should not be referred to as such. The secret was/is a total psuedoscience crock of shit. but I am a firm believer that people want to be told what to do especially by Oprah .
crazyoldcatlady
QUOTE
A little off-topic from CBC, but I thought y'all would be interested- the cover story in Newsweek this week is a very interesting article about Oprah's poor track record of recommending medical procedures.


i saw that, bookmarked it. those kind of things get me all sorts of riled up. jenny mccarthy, stfu. suzanne sommers, stfu. you are NOT medically trained, and no matter how much "research" you do, you are not in a position to IRRESPONSIBLY hand out shady medical advice to the masses.

QUOTE
I share some of beliefs of the "quack" doctors. However, science has been working hard to supporting evidence for eastern medicine which has been long pegged some form of black magic. I think the article was correct that Oprah does not allow for deferring opinions


i believe that the mind and the body are irrevocably interconnected, and that one affects the other. i also believe that there are ancient traditions and holistic methods that can be utilized for medicinal purposes (after all, aspirin was discovered from tree bark after indigenous peoples were noted to chew on it for pain relief).

but at the end of the day, it ALL has to go through the (rigorous) scientific method to gain validity in my book.



okay, i suppose i should post something CBC-related... i didn't have to go to a coworkers baby shower recently. it violated my "no wedding attendance unless i'm in the bridal party, no baby showers unless it's my sister." i think i'm going to amend that to "purchase no gifts if not attending said shower".
raisingirl
*delurk*

I fucking HATED that Secret shit. What a bunch of bollocks. I almost hate it as much as I hate Suzanne Somers for popping pills and injecting herself with all sorts of crap that's going to make her live to 110. Almost.

*relurking*
prophecy_grrl
uh, not to continue derailing, but what ever happened to the Oprah thread? Not enough interest? I have some thoughts to contribute on this topic and some (repeat) episodes from last week. Guess I will mosey on over to the community forum and see!

sassy - I have heard variations on that line myself. I've heard stuff along the lines of motherhood is the ultimate expression of femininity, or to be a complete/true/real woman is to be a mom, etc. It's usually framed in this mother-earthy, pseudo-feminist manner, but to me it's one of the most heinous pro-natalist, feminist backlash pieces of crap I've heard. Nice way to completely diminish all of the other things women can/should/have accomplished. Plus, it's not as if we need to further narrow gender norms or femininity.

also, I have a confession. I would take it to the confessions thread, but I think I might really offend someone, so I'll put it here. This has been bugging me for awhile, so here goes: I am sick of people treating infertility like it's the worst thing that could happen to them. I am not unsympathetic. I think everyone should be able to get what they want from life - whatever makes them happy. I do feel bad for people who really and truly want kids but cannot have them. This is related to a couple we know (and in fairness, I have a lot of other issues with the woman in question) who have been trying to get pregnant for a little over a year and have just started ART. By anyone's standards they have a great life - good jobs, good health, nice condo, they travel all over the world (frequently) - yet all we hear about is what a failure she feels like cause she can't get pregnant, how unhappy she is cause she's not a mom, oh and how adoption "is not an option." I sound like an unsympathetic bitch, but I just want to tell her to get some fucking perspective, be thankful for what she has, find a way to love and be part or a child's life if that's what's *really* important. sigh. It doesn't help that we don't get along anyway and that she's kind of mean and bitchy just generally. I know I would be more supportive and understanding if it were a close friend I really cared about. Still, I maintain there are worse things to have to endure than infertility.

ETA: COC - I have the exact same shower rules! just RSVP'd "nope" to one today. ha!
stargazer
I think the Secret was a merely theoretical book not based on evidence that people ate up like candy. I don't like that she uses celebrities experience of experimential treatment as the truth either. I think people's attachment to Oprah (which is totally unhealthy) is clearly evident that some people do not want to think for themselves. I think that is what scares me the most.

I will add that I am really biased with being pro-alternative and complimentary medicine and I've done research about the inclusion of spirituality in treatment. So, I know I am totally coming from left field in my point of view.
crazyoldcatlady
QUOTE
I've done research about the inclusion of spirituality in treatment. So, I know I am totally coming from left field in my point of view.


it's not really left field, and don't feel like you need to "apologize". science and medicine does have a maaaajor pitfall, in that obsession with the abstract neglects the bigger human picture. okay, i'm rambling. what i mean to say, is that science DOES neglect the spirit more often than not. upwards of 80% of americans die in a hospital, undergoing futile and invasive treatments, when there should be a greater role of hospice and better awareness of advance directives.


AHHHHH my head is esplodin' with talking points. this is a big derail, where can we take this for anyone interested?


okay, CBC related: I want a dog wink.gif
pollystyrene
QUOTE(stargazer @ Jun 1 2009, 03:59 PM) *
Polly, I think Oprah's failings on alternative and complimentary medicine is that she does not present enough data or evidence practice to support this type of medicine. I share some of beliefs of the "quack" doctors. However, science has been working hard to supporting evidence for eastern medicine which has been long pegged some form of black magic. I think the article was correct that Oprah does not allow for deferring opinions. Also, I should mention that believe in the law of attraction and like attracts like. I think if I didn't follow this belief pattern then I wouldn't have met you or the other Chicago busties.


When I said "quack" I was referring more to the doctors who support Suzanne Somers' theories, Dr. Northrup (who said that HPV can be prevented through a better diet, you can diagnose yourself with Tarot cards, as well as some misleading information on how to treat thyroid problems) and whoever came up with that "thread lift" thing (egad!) Of course there's value in meditation, positive thinking and paying attention to the signals your body is giving you; but all of that can only go so far- Oprah found herself backpedaling when that woman said she was using the methods in The Secret to treat her breast cancer, rather than the medical treatment her doctors wanted her to do.

QUOTE
The Secret warns that all illness and misfortune is caused by attracting the negative power of the universe. "You cannot 'catch' anything unless you think you can," it says. "You are also inviting illness if you are listening to people talking about their illness."


That's straight out of Scientology's belief that diseases like cancer and AIDS are just a state of mind.

girltrouble
derailment moved to the oprah thread. wub.gif
sybarite
Prophecygirl, I don't know anyone close to me undergoing fertility treatments but I do have friends who desperately want to have their own (biological) child. I cannot empathise but I know they feel it as pain, so I sympathise, albeit abstractly.

Saying that, it infuriates me that fertility has apparently become a commodity, something that can ultimately be bought. This infuriates me for so many reasons; why not adopt; why must the biological imperative outweigh every other consideration, such as your health, your finances, your relationship; the lucrative industry that has sprung from infertility; and finally the idea that it is your right to bear children. Which is to say, I agree with your post.
crazyoldcatlady
QUOTE
Prophecygirl, I don't know anyone close to me undergoing fertility treatments but I do have friends who desperately want to have their own (biological) child. I cannot empathise but I know they feel it as pain, so I sympathise, albeit abstractl

Saying that, it infuriates me that fertility has apparently become a commodity, something that can ultimately be bought. This infuriates me for so many reasons; why not adopt; why must the biological imperative outweigh every other consideration, such as your health, your finances, your relationship; the lucrative industry that has sprung from infertility


i agree with pretty much everything you said, syb. i think i'm generally suspect of people's intentions when they go above and beyond the call of duty to bear a child in lieu of other options (adoption); how much of it is really about wanting a child and impacting someone's (future)life positively, and how much of it is about your own vanity?

but hey, at the end of the day it's all legal and sanctioned, and it's your body and you can undergo whatever invasive and expensive treatments you want in order to grow a litter.

but let it be known that (crazyold) celing cat (lady) is judging you! wink.gif
pollystyrene
QUOTE(sybarite @ Jun 2 2009, 04:11 AM) *
Saying that, it infuriates me that fertility has apparently become a commodity, something that can ultimately be bought. This infuriates me for so many reasons; why not adopt; why must the biological imperative outweigh every other consideration, such as your health, your finances, your relationship; the lucrative industry that has sprung from infertility; and finally the idea that it is your right to bear children. Which is to say, I agree with your post.


Cod, LeBoy's sister was telling me about her best friend, who is currently pregnant with her second child. She has diabetes and other health issues; basically, she's Julia Roberts in Steel Magnolia's. With her first kid, she was on bed rest at 6 months and the baby was born about 6 weeks early because of numerous health problems, though I think the kid is fine now. LeSister was telling me that she asked her friend if her doctor has told her officially that she needs to stop having kids. She said, "well, more or less, yes, but someone needs to tell [my husband] because he's already thinking about number three- he wants to try for a boy." LeSister was just dumbstruck that this guy knows how dangerous it is for his wife to be pregnant, and all the risks the baby is at, and he wants to fulfill some egotistical need for a boy. blink.gif
thepointybird
Holy feck all, just had to pop in and share this little gem of a snippet that I overheard on the train yesterday. Timely as we were just discussing Breeder Bingo, this definitely deserves its own square on the board.

So these two girls were chatting on the train, pretty young, probably early to mid 20s. I wasn't paying much attention until I heard this from one of them (I'm paraphrasing of course):

"I basically told her that I don't think she's really in love with him, I mean what kind of woman is in love with a man but doesn't want to have his kids?"

So there ya go, married and attached CBC Busties! Alert your man right now to the fact that you're probably not really in love with him, because after all, if you were, you'd totally wanna gestate his spawn, right? I'm hoping the chick that she said this to gave her a resounding smack in the grill.....

stargazer
laugh.gif
prettynpink
I am astounded at the amount of people I know that are breeding (I was told that I'm not ready to have kids if I call it breeding)...At least 10.

I feel like I'm the only one (besides one other friend) that is adamant about not having kids. I dont know if I'll want them later in life, but now, I dont. That also means I dont want to hold your damned baby, throw a baby shower for you (unless you dig a potluck with no games), go to a baby shower for you, deal with crying, spit up or diapers. I am happy to report that I have yet to change a diaper. When/If I do, that child will be mine.

Please stop sending me pictures of your children. They're weird looking and I dont have enough of a filter to KEEP saying "awwww" One day that filter will snap and I'll tell you that your child really looks like a billiard ball with bug eyes and droopy jowls. Its creepy.

Now, sure, I'm happy to play with them for about 5 minutes. A baby's laugh is infectious. But other than that, no thank you. I dont want to hold them. I dont have motherhood muscles. I admire yours but I cannot hold a 10lb baby for more than about 5 minutes. My muscles burn and they try to nurse. I cant blame them. I've got what must seem like milk mecca for them, but its rather awkward and not as funny as you seem to think.

I dont want babies. I dont want to see your baby. I understand the need to show the new thing off, because thats how I feel about my new shoes, and those didnt come out of my vagina. But, please, show some respect to the childless by choice and leave me alone.

/rant
culturehandy
Yes, I saw via crackbook, that yet another person I went to high school with his having crotch fruit.

I don't even respond to baby pictures, I don't comment when people post pics of status updates about their bebes, because I don't care.
girltrouble
lol.... pink your talk about a baby filter made me think about a google app that automatically replies to your emails. i'm wondering how well it would do cooing at people's baby pix...
candycane_girl
Ugh, the whole concept of IVF drives me batty. I understand that some people really want to have children but I can't understand why some people just won't accept that they aren't fertile. Also, why do so many pepole say that adoption is "not an option"? Are you so vain that you want to be able to see yourself in your child? It's just ridiculous. Adoption is expensive but so is IVF. It might be hard to find someone willing to give up a baby right from birth but it can be done.

I know that IVF can work for some couples and they end up only having one child or maybe twins. But it seems a bit excessive to me that couples will have the procedure done over and over so that they can have more kids and I don't understand the doctors who put in so many eggs that a woman ends up having a litter.

I always go back to Jon and Kate Plus 8. I still can't believe that a woman who had so much trouble conceiving in the first place wouldn't just be happy with twins. But noooooo, she wanted "just one more" and we all know what happened after that. To me the whole thing is just so incredibly selfish.

Anyway, that's the end of my rant
.
pollystyrene
QUOTE(candycane_girl @ Jun 2 2009, 01:18 PM) *

I always go back to Jon and Kate Plus 8. I still can't believe that a woman who had so much trouble conceiving in the first place wouldn't just be happy with twins. But noooooo, she wanted "just one more" and we all know what happened after that. To me the whole thing is just so incredibly selfish.
.


I watched a couple minutes of that train wreck last night (mostly to annoy LeBoy so he'd give me the laptop in exchange for the remote tongue.gif ) and it was just so awful. Those people are so freaking selfish (hmm, something the breeders usually call us, huh?) and bitter. That show, even before the drama in the past few months, is just one big argument NOT to have kids. I saw a clip from Good Morning America or one of the other morning shows with Kate's sister (?) talking about neither of then realize how toxic and exploitive it is to keep going on with the show.
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