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kari
HOLY SHIT!

What an episode. No wasting time now, it seems. I was very sad about Bobby. Nickclick, wonderful observations about Bobby, Jr & the trains. I hadn't thought of that.

I have no idea what's going to happen next week.

I too hope Silvio doesn't die.

Wowzers.
mermaidgirl13
I thinking that if Sil dies and Paulie gets shot too, then Tony might flip and turn government witness. That would be a pretty big twist.

I know he's always talking about how gutless people who flip are, but if Paulie, Sil, Christopher, Bobby and who knows who else are dead, he won't have a crew left to protect anyway, so why not?
nickclick
if tony flipped, that would be a good twist. but anti-climatic. i want more bloodbath!

for your (almost) post-sopranos needs
chachaheels
Bloodbath assured!

I am going to miss this show.

Everyone in it is going to miss this show, too. Not many good projects out there in TV land (or movie land, for that matter).
I can't imagine what everyone will have to do to top The Sopranos.

How are we ever going to see Gandolfini playing anyone else--and not think of Tony Soprano--again?
or Michael Imperioli? Drea di Matteo's already had a hard time "being" other characters.
And who will let David Chase make TV like this (at his own pace, with no time restrictions, with the actors and writers and directors he choses to work with only...?) again?
girltrouble
meh. i don't think ms falco or chrisopher imperioli will have trouble finding work-- they were already working charecter actors and still find work away from the show. personally i still think if christopher as spider from goodfellas, and edie as the sister from trust as much as the sopranos... but the rest of them...hmmm not good.

good episode though. i had butterflies the entire time. tonite is gonna be great!
candycane_girl
Wow. I don't even know what to say about the last episode. Definitely not as much blood as I expected. And as for the very end of it, I actually thought my television had stopped working for a second. I just don't know what to say!
stargazer
i knew tony would live. but, i was shocked that phil got whacked. i kinda like the way it ended. even with all of the tragedy they have endured, i liked that it showed how all of the characters returned to normal and did not learn one thing in their lives. i wonder if they will still make a movie.
mandolyn
fuck you, david chase. i thought it was evil incarnate when you made us wait a year and a half between seasons. (and dark, dead, BORING seasons - compared to previous years - to boot.) but THIS is the cherry on the top. you cheated us, you dishonored the characters. lame asshole. i'm not even sure i care now if there is a movie.

total.crap.ending. the asstwat writers from lost could've done better.

i think i would've rathered tony wake up in some regular old ho-hum suburban split-ranch, realizing he's truly kevin finnerty.
girltrouble
um.. i kinda liked the ending too. *shrugs* if there had been a blood bath there would have been closure, and that seems a bit too neat for the show. and as a friend put it, sopranos was always fantastic because of the way it made the mundane strange. and the end-- the last 5 or so minutes was exactly that-- mundane, but so suspenseful-- i thought it was hilarous. it defied expectations, and gave you nothing that you demand (i.e. tidy little finish that clears up all the loose ends).

in a filmic sense, putting that long black bit at the end was telling us to write our own story, after all, there were enough threads in the final sequence-- the guy at the counter. the kids at the juke box, etc.--- there was plenty to weave our own ending. or, if we chose to go further back in the episode, it could mean indictment. it could even indicate death. but it felt like...well it felt like you had more stories to tell, but just didn't want to. and as much as i like what the "ending" means, it still feels a bit cheap.

it felt like other infamous series finales-- the most notorious of which was st. elsewhere's autistic child, but without the cleverness. or 6ft under's epic epitath. but i have to say all and all, this compared to 6 feet under, it seemed like the sopranos ending would have fit that show better and vice versa. 6ft was constantly, consistantly NOT giving answers, and unlike shows like lost, it never felt contrived or forced. it just felt, sad, unfortunate, but understandable. it fit in with it's themes. and that's one of the things that made 6ft so great-- it's not as if it was any less morbid, it's sense of humor less dark, it's body count any less. it was it's combonation of randomness and fatalism, that made it work. it loved to leave ends frayed, things unresolved. charecters disappeared, got killed in 6ft, and the charecters were as bewildered as we were. when nate was asked what happened to his wife--he broke down, angry and crying, and were just as frustrated.

the sopranos, on the other hand, loved spelling it out for us in gory detail. if a charecter was gay, we followed that charecter, even far from jersey until that charecter was.... resolved. we watched chareters bloody deaths choreographed to music. and knew EXACTLY why they needed whacking. but with six feet, death, life, love were all just... mysterious. perpexing. but it's conclusion worked all the better because it gave you exactly what you wanted-- (seeing how everyone lived/died) but STILL left you unsatisfied. as happy as you were right after watching it's finale, there was this horrible aftertaste. this awful longing: after all, it was all the little things beween birth and death, the odd little twists, those frustrating mysteries that made those charecters breathe, and knowing when clare died, who she married, etc,-- felt like there were all these episodes out there we'd never get to see, and that makes my heart ache to this day.

as i said, i adore non-endings-- if-- if it's consistant with the show, but because it's not, much as i enjoyed it, still feels like cheating. maybe it's because of hbo's annoying season stretching, but here it feels like there is one more episode that will be released on a dvd box set.

jemisoutrageous
QUOTE(mandolyn @ Jun 11 2007, 03:22 AM) *
fuck you, david chase. i thought it was evil incarnate when you made us wait a year and a half between seasons. (and dark, dead, BORING seasons - compared to previous years - to boot.) but THIS is the cherry on the top. you cheated us, you dishonored the characters. lame asshole. i'm not even sure i care now if there is a movie.

total.crap.ending. the asstwat writers from lost could've done better.

i think i would've rathered tony wake up in some regular old ho-hum suburban split-ranch, realizing he's truly kevin finnerty.



That's what I'm screaming, Mando. FUCK HIM. After 8 years of audience loyalty he took a shit all over us and I hate him.
nickclick
i wasn't expecting a traditional ending. but i didn't like this choose-your-own adventure ending either. it was a cop out, like chase couldn't decide how to end it, so he left it open to interpretation or guesses. that's all we've been doing these past few weeks is guessing! i wanted some sort of resolution. it was like a dirty trick, a bad practical joke, and a lame hitchcock ripoff. at least hitchcock created suspense for a payoff.

my mom actually went switching around the channels, thinking her cable went out.

i am on the search for that diner, though! when i've had the onion rings, i'll letcha know.
nickclick
oh, and journey????? don't stop believin'? wha? if it was ironic, which i'm guessing was the intention, i didn't get it.
candycane_girl
I think a lot of people thought that their cable went out, lol.

I've been hearing over and over that they left the ending open on purpose, in case they ever want to bring it back. Personally, I think it would be terrible to bring The Sopranos back. They had a good run, it should be left alone.

The leaving it open is one theory I've been seeing. The other I've been seeing is that that dead silence relates to something that one of the characters (I think it was either Tony or Paulie, really can't remember) said about how you never hear the gunshot that's meant for you.
mermaidgirl13
The diner's in Bloomfield, NickClick.
nickclick
QUOTE(candycane_girl @ Jun 11 2007, 12:08 PM) *
The leaving it open is one theory I've been seeing. The other I've been seeing is that that dead silence relates to something that one of the characters (I think it was either Tony or Paulie, really can't remember) said about how you never hear the gunshot that's meant for you.

that was my bf's first thought, that the silence meant he was shot. but i dunno, the show's never been told from the 1st person before. tony's the main character, but plenty of stuff has gone on without his knowledge.

thanks mermaid!
girltrouble
was tony in the last frame? i don't think he was, but more than that, the most likely gunman was heading to the restroom the last shot we see him. now, if he was walking towards tony, that might be something but as it was shot, the silence theory is empty. add nickclicks point that the show was rarely shot in first person.

but i have to dispute your assertion that hitch created suspense for a pay off. he was equally known for his mcguffin-- another name for his red herrings. and i thought the end was plenty suspenseful dispite the lack of payoff.


sassygrrl
I wish I had a DVR. I'm sure I wasn't the only person that thought my cable went out. Mcgeek and I had recently (as of Saturday night actually) been fighting with Comcast LOL.

I don't think Tony was in the last frame. Meadow was.

I'm still having mixed feelings about the ending. I didn't hate it. Oh, I loved that Paulie little comic relief with the cat. smile.gif

Was the Kevin Finnerty dreams in Season 6 or Season 5?
sidecar
I actually liked it quite a lot. I thought it was in keeping with the spirit of the show, and really, what I liked about it is that for Tony, every action, no matter how mundane, even eating onion rings with his family, is filled with dread -- either someone's going to hurt him or he's going to be taken away. It's a prison of his own making, but a prison nonetheless. Watching it a second time helped.

I think it would've been cheap if he'd been killed and cheaper still if he'd been arrested. It's not closure, but I far preferred the tense build to the sudden stop than Agent Harris hauling him off or Members Only shooting him in the head.

I also thought my cable broke. But like I said, I was far more taken with the ending when I rewatched it.
sassygrrl
I may have to rewatch it.
zoya
**de-lurks**

A friend forwarded this to me today, it was from a friend of a friend and it's his theory - I think it's a pretty damn good one....


"So here is what I found out. The guy at the bar is also credited as Nikki Leotardo. The same actor played him in the first part of season 6 during a brief sit down concerning the future of Vito. That wasn't that long ago. Apparently, he is the nephew of Phil. Phil's brother Nikki Senior was killed in 1976 in a car accident. Absolutely Genius!!!! David Chase is truly rewarding the true fans who pay attention to detail.

So the point would have been that life continues and we may never know the end of the Sopranos. But if you pay attention to the history, you will find that all the answers lie in the characters in the restaurant. The trucker was the brother of the guy who was robbed by Christopher in Season 2. Remember the DVD players? The trucker had to identify the body. The boy scouts were in the train store and the brothas at the end were the ones who tried to kill Tony and only clipped him in the ear (was that season 2 or 3?).

Absolutely incredible!!!! There were three people in the restaurant who had reason to kill Tony and then it just ends. This was Chase's way of proving that he will not escape his past. It will not go on forever despite that he would like it to "don't stop". Not the fans!!! Tony would like it to keep going but just as we have to say goodbye, so does he."
girltrouble
that's a great theory, z, but the snotty brat in me screams, "goddamnit, of all the labored explinations!" but fuck me, it makes sense. plus, even durring the viewing, i thought the shots of the people in the diner were a bit...odd. the camera lingered on them, giving them slo-mo as if they meant something. the speed changes in the sequence really added to the tension...hmmm...
nickclick
this interview with david chase debunks that theory in the last graph, and a few others.
candycane_girl
Y'know, what I like is the fact that this ending has us all talking! It almost seems like Chase did it so that he would have this result, all of the fans talking, speculating, developing theories.

Sassy, the Kevin Finnerty dreams were in the first part of season 6.

Zoya, I think the episode where the guys try to hit Tony was the second last episode of season 1. I like the theory that your friend sent to you but I just don't know what to think! I think David Chase is just saying that he wasn't trying to mess with us but deep down, he really was.
chachaheels
I read about the Nikki Leotardo theory but I also read that the credits don't list the actor who played Nikki earlier as part of the episode's cast, nor do they list the character as being part of the episode. As nice as it would have been to have a series of clues about potential outcomes, I'm afraid that theory's been debunked.

There is something about the idea that Tony is able to regroup, with his family, at the end of the show. At some point, each of them "left"--Carmela flirted with the idea of an affair, and then a divorce; Meadow left the family for school and contemplated going overseas to study, or moving to the West Coast with Finn; and AJ tried to suicide. And at the end, Tony waits for each one to "come home", as they come into the diner one by one. Remember his big concerns about the duck and her ducklings? Even though he drained the pool (ultimately, a chlorine laden brine is no place for a duck to raise her ducklings--plus, there's nothing to eat there, they'd all starve), everyone who matters manages to find him again, no matter what has separated them or taken place before.

I kinda like that Chase didn't play into his audience's predictions, didn't wrap things up nicely, and simply forced us to stop watching the story the moment it was resolved. I think he hit us over the head a bit with Journey and "Don't Stop! Believing!" but I think that's because of his sense of humour is a little dusky.
nickclick
seriously! that song's the worst. it's like eating a giant chicken parm sub and trying to fuggetaboutit, but you can't because you're burping garlic all week.
girltrouble
hey! no badmouthing jouney OR garlic!
candycane_girl
Mmmm, Journey and garlic.


Was anyone else weirded out by the way they were eating onion rings? Just popping the entire thing into their mouths, no attempt to take small bites.

Am I the only person that tries not to shove entire onion rings into my mouth?
nickclick
my mom thought it was some kinda catholic reference, like they were eating the onion rings like communion wafers. but this weekend mr.nick's brother said he's been to that place, and that's the traditional way to eat them or something.
candycane_girl
Lol, nickclick, I was just going to mention the catholic thing too! I was listening to the oldies station this morning and one of the hosts said the same thing.
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