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roseviolet
Ellievee, it's interesting that you bring this up because my BestGalPal is going through something similar to what your boy is living through. It sounds to me like you're doing the right thing by just listening. You know him better than any of us, of course, so only you can decide whether it's a good idea to encourage him to visit his mother. But based on my experience with my BestGalPal, it's best to just listen and let him think through and talk through this. If he's going to see her, he needs to come to that decision all on his own without any pressure from others. He obviously developed some deep, deep scars from their relationship. I wouldn't blame him if he didn't want to open those old wounds.
ellievee
QUOTE(roseviolet @ Mar 26 2008, 09:54 PM) *
Ellievee, it's interesting that you bring this up because my BestGalPal is going through something similar to what your boy is living through. It sounds to me like you're doing the right thing by just listening. You know him better than any of us, of course, so only you can decide whether it's a good idea to encourage him to visit his mother. But based on my experience with my BestGalPal, it's best to just listen and let him think through and talk through this. If he's going to see her, he needs to come to that decision all on his own without any pressure from others. He obviously developed some deep, deep scars from their relationship. I wouldn't blame him if he didn't want to open those old wounds.


i agree, that's why i didn't say much, just listened. but he's made the decision on his own, and i'm glad he has...he's feeling so much better!
kittenb
I just want to thank everyone in this thread for being smarter than I am and willing to share your experiences with me. You all helped me not make a big mistake. smile.gif

In other words, things are going good. Apparently, communications works. Who knew? rolleyes.gif
edie52
QUOTE
In other words, things are going good. Apparently, communications works. Who knew?


Hee hee. I've had lots of similar moments of realizing the obvious. Glad to hear that things are going well.
nickclick
glad to hear it, kitten. no one's smarter; it's easier to see things from the outside.
obelix2
QUOTE(nickclick @ Mar 30 2008, 01:47 PM) *
no one's smarter; it's easier to see things from the outside.


Ain't that the truth! Why is it so hard to see exactly what's going on in a relationship from the inside? Last week I was traveling for work and I got mad at my guy for acting like himself on the phone. So I called my bff at midnight to complain. He sighed and reminded me that I always get over it very quickly. I woke up in the morning feeling sheepish because the boy hadn't done anything wrong. He had said what I wanted him to on the phone, but he used his words instead of mine. My bff knew this, because it happens once a week or so. But I simply can not see it while it's happening.

Congratulations, kittenb! It sounds like it worked out about the best it could. Good job!
nickclick
mr.nick and i are engaged!

i was annoyed with him yesterday because he told me he was going to hang out with his friend to play video games on our first sunday with nothing to do in a while. but really he drove an hour away to talk to my parents about asking me. (I know, cheesy, but it made my parents happy) then last night he proposed! i've gotten about 2 hours of sleep.
p_176
congratulations!!!!!!
kittenb
Congratulations NickClick!!!!!

As a side note, the idea of anyone asking my father if he could marry me just makes me laugh. It would be like that scene in the first episode of Alias where Spy Daddy just eviscerates Sidney's beau for even trying it. Not to diminish what Mr. Nick did. Sometimes I wish my father was a little more traditional. rolleyes.gif
Mr Pugs
I view it as a sign of respect. LMP and I were dating for 8 years before I proposed, and I still went to her father first. To me it's just a respect thing.
roseviolet
Congratulations, NickClick!!! How wonderful!

And now ... the planning begins ... blink.gif
crinoline
Congrats! And it's so sweet that he asked your daddy first. *throws premature rice*
Mr Pugs
*slaps head* oh yeah....congrats!!!!
shinyx3
squee! being just engaged is so fun! congratulations!
sybarite
Congrats nickclick and mr nickclick!!! We've been engaged for almost three years now and I still like how it feels. For us, it has made a difference, kind of consolidated our commitment to each other. Yay for you two!!
konphusion26
A million congrats to nickclick and mr. nick!
LoveMyPugs
QUOTE(sybarite @ Mar 31 2008, 01:17 PM) *
Congrats nickclick and mr nickclick!!! We've been engaged for almost three years now and I still like how it feels. For us, it has made a difference, kind of consolidated our commitment to each other. Yay for you two!!


sore throat...can't sleep

we've been engaged for three years now as well. i feel like sybarite does. it's just made us more solid.

pugs

congratulations!!
nickclick
oh my, thanks so much! i feel the love, even more. yesterday was one of the most fun days ever, telling everyone we know. everyone's saying such nice things about us. by the way, we've always been nice.... why do we have to be engaged to hear it? ha ha i don't care.

yeah, my dad is traditional in that regard. actually, he talked to both my parents. i'm glad he did, mostly to make my parents happy, but also because i'm close with my family and they love him, so it's good that he's including them in the process.
deschatsrouge
Yay for Nickclick and Mr. Nick! Congrats!
chickenlittle
Congrats, Nickclick! Woo!
nickclick
so many thanks. it's true that it feels different now that i know i'm gonna be with him for-ev-er. i know we can plan on forever without the rings and the legality and the party and all, but to make that commitment so public, just feels more official. i dunno, maybe i'm overthinking, and maybe i'm feeling like i'm losing my feminist cred (i will keep my name at least!). i always thought weddings and marriage were kind of cheesy, but i am enjoying this.
sybarite
Nickclick, I had a very very similar reaction. I never saw myself getting married to be honest; it came about, I think, because the mister is generally more traditional/conventional than I am. I also don't feel any couple needs a ceremony or a ring or legal documents to make them committed.

But... the proposal delighted and almost shocked me (even though I knew it was coming). More to the point, I waited to be proposed to, even though I have declared myself a feminist since I was about 10. I loved telling people, and have loved showing the ring.

It certainly has drawn us closer together, possibly by reminding us that even through the disagreements and the flat-out fights, we're in this for the long haul.

I am keeping my name though!
quink
Hi... I used to post here ages ago (before things changed too...) and though I haven't been posting lately I have been lurking about this thread as everthing seems to speak to me and reading all the posts has made me feel more positive about things that are going on... So I hope you don't mind if I jump in when you don't really know me?! I haven't got the time to write properly just now but I guess I just wanted to introduce myself and say hi and tell you I will be back with my 'commited' story to see if anyone can help/sympathise/tell me I'm being silly!
roseviolet
Nick, you are not overthinking and you definitely are NOT losing your feminist cred!

When Sheff and I got engaged, it definitely felt different, but in a great way. What surprised me was that I didn't feel like screaming the news from the highest mountain or anything like that. Instead, it felt intensely personal and special - something that should be cherished and protected. Don't get me wrong, though. I was very happy! The thought that he wanted me to be his partner and that I'd found such a dear, sweet man ... well, it made me blush and smile and blush some more for weeks. The decision to get engaged felt like our official declaration of our devotion to one another. In a way, getting married felt like it would just be a formaility after that, but suprisingly, I also felt different after we made it legal. We were officially, legally, and spiritually a partnership (and considering we were from two different countries, the marriage meant we wouldn't have to be seperated again - a HUGE plus for us!).

ETA: Hi, Quink!
quink
Right, I'm back and prepared to try and put into words how I feel... I'm not all that good at words! I guess I am hoping that at the very least putting it in writing will help to sort things out in my head.

So, I'm 31 and have been with the boy for 5 years, living together for 3 this summer. We get on great, we are best friends too, we laugh we share the same outlook and attitude to life and I love him very much. And he loves me.

Recently though I have been feeling so lost and needy and I'm not sure entirely why. I am constantly thinking about 'us' (whereas I am pretty sure he's not - man thing I guess) and wondering if everything is ok and it's draining. I feel a bit like he gives all his time and energy to his job (which is not a job he loves but allows him time to do other things) and his band (band doing well, not HUGE but well). A part of me wishes that his spare time was more devoted to me and us, when I know that he just gets on with the other things in his life and I am just 'there'. Which is good, people should have full and interesting lives and be excited by things - I have lots going on in my life too - but I am feeling just now as if I am not of any interest to him. However, he tells me he loves me all the time and is affectionate so what's the problem?! I just can't put my finger on why I think things seem different, it just a feeling. I ask him if everything is ok as he seem a little odd and he's like "In what way?" and I can't answer that. I now I think I am going mad and being crazy and irrational and the more I think and over-analyse the more mad and obsessed I get.

Perhaps this is just a low in the 5 years and things do go 'up and down', but, ugh, I hate feeling like this. I also don't really have friends who I talk to about this stuff. I mean, there are people who are there for me and would listen, but I am and never have been someone to discuss my relationships, possibly I feel that I don't want anyone to know if there is a problem even if all relationships go through that.

Damn it, I've totally rambled. There is so much more I could write about but obvioulsy this thread can't be all about me.

quink
Right, I'm back and prepared to try and put into words how I feel... I'm not all that good at words! I guess I am hoping that at the very least putting it in writing will help to sort things out in my head.

So, I'm 31 and have been with the boy for 5 years, living together for 3 this summer. We get on great, we are best friends too, we laugh we share the same outlook and attitude to life and I love him very much. And he loves me.

Recently though I have been feeling so lost and needy and I'm not sure entirely why. I am constantly thinking about 'us' (whereas I am pretty sure he's not - man thing I guess) and wondering if everything is ok and it's draining. I feel a bit like he gives all his time and energy to his job (which is not a job he loves but allows him time to do other things) and his band (band doing well, not HUGE but well). A part of me wishes that his spare time was more devoted to me and us, when I know that he just gets on with the other things in his life and I am just 'there'. Which is good, people should have full and interesting lives and be excited by things - I have lots going on in my life too - but I am feeling just now as if I am not of any interest to him. However, he tells me he loves me all the time and is affectionate so what's the problem?! I just can't put my finger on why I think things seem different, it just a feeling. I ask him if everything is ok as he seem a little odd and he's like "In what way?" and I can't answer that. I now I think I am going mad and being crazy and irrational and the more I think and over-analyse the more mad and obsessed I get.

Perhaps this is just a low in the 5 years and things do go 'up and down', but, ugh, I hate feeling like this. I also don't really have friends who I talk to about this stuff. I mean, there are people who are there for me and would listen, but I am and never have been someone to discuss my relationships, possibly I feel that I don't want anyone to know if there is a problem even if all relationships go through that.

Damn it, I've totally rambled. There is so much more I could write about but obvioulsy this thread can't be all about me.

quink
Argh, computer went squiffy. Double post - sorry.
nickclick
thanks, rose. his mom put me on the spot and asked me this weekend if i was going to keep my name, and i'm all fumbling for words, like - blahhhhh i never thought i would but i dunno - because i don't want her to think i don't like their family, but i like mine too, you know?

quink, i don't think it's too much to ask your mr. for some extra attention if you're in need of it, for whatever reason. being needy and having needs are two different things. it's not like you want to compromise his time for his job and band and etc. all the time, just maybe once in a while.

yeah, i'm the same about talking to people IRL about my relationship problems. around here it's easier tho, because you know you're around like-minded nice people. so, welcome!
roseviolet
Quink, I agree with Nick. Nothing wrong with wanting to spend more time with your boy. I feel this way sometimes, too, but it doesn't work for me to just say, "Hey. I want us to spend more time together," because then he feels like it's up to him to do all of the planning. Sheff isn't so go about that. He responds much better if I say, "Hey, let's go see such & such movie together." or "There's a restaurant I want to check out. Let's go there Thursday night." But that's just us. smile.gif

Nick, I understand about the name thing. I always assumed I would change my name ... until we got closer to the wedding day. Then I realized that I really didn't want to. Over the years, so many things have changed about me - my body, my interests, my friends, the places I've lived - but the only thing that hasn't changed is my name. I like having this one, consistent thing in my life. Plus, I hate it when anyone assumes I should do anything just because I'm female. So here I am - 3 years after the wedding - with the same name I've always had. Sheff was surprised that I changed my mind on this subject, but he realized that he wouldn't like it if society expected him to change his name. He's taken the whatever-makes-you-happy-honey stance on this one. My mother is the only one who has trouble understanding my choice, but she has never said that it was wrong. Just ... different.
quink
Nick, thanks. You're right about the needs/needy thing. I think though that sometimes it's not so much that I need something, it's that when I say anything he doesn't seem to feel the same way. Like me knowing that our schedules are totally out of sync for a week or so and saying to him that that means we won't see each other and he's like "Well, yeah, but things like that happen, and I'll see you in bed at night". It's not like he doesn't care, he just gets on with life whereas I think too much. Is that a girl/guy thing?!

However, the past week has been great and we've been having fun. So I can't complain. Things are good, great even, there are just little niggles that piss me off!

Plus 3 couple that I knew who had been going out for a long time have split up. Makes you think..... I was thinking about them and searching for signs that might have suggested it was going to happen, but I guess what you see is only the public face of a relationship and you can't tell much from that.
AAGirl
I think I'm posting this in the right area but someone may think the "Let's Talk About Sex" forum is more fitting... let me know...

I'm in a fairly new relationship - not even a year yet - and am now 36 and my bf is 42. When we met it was sparks a flyin' and great conversation and the whole nine. We have had conversations about being "older" and not fucking around anymore and, hey, maybe it's time to think about getting married and having kids. He's way into the idea of marriage and kids. His eyes light up every time it's mentioned. He gets a sheepish grin anytime marriage is suggested. I know he loves me. He pretty much dotes on me. He's funny and lovely and I could see myself spending the rest of my life with him. I've asked that we keep the marriage talk under wraps until we've been together for a year but he can't help bringing it up. It's cute but...

Our sex life has taken a nose dive. Of course I expect that to happen but it seems premature, we've only been seeing each other for eight months. In his previous relationship his ex "pressured" him for sex. She didn't work and he works in a very stressful environment and he said his libido just isn't there when he's stressed. He said in retrospect he realized he wasn't attracted to her anymore. I wish that he had never told me that. Because now I am like, uh - what happened to the guy who fucked for hours and now barely touches me but once every week or two? Maybe he's not attracted to me anymore? I asked him, of course, and he said he's stressed. And he is, I see that. And he's 42. At any rate, it's gotten to where if I initiate sex or (god forbid) get upset that we aren't having sex he shuts down on me. There's been times where he'll placate me and have sex with me but it's cold and kinda sad. He told me if I stop talking about it he'll come around. I've tried that but then I wonder, how long am I not talking about it? I feel repressed, like he's holding our sex life hostage. It's making me resentful towards him. I feel like I need to disconnect. I'm super attracted to him but I avert my eyes when he undresses and I try not to touch him too much, don't want to make him feel "pressured."

I'm an extremely sexual person and I told him that I don't care about money or having a big house, I want a fun, exciting sex life! He promised me that will happen if I "relax." So I'm trying to. But now when he wants to have sex I feel like he's doing it because he feels obligated, like he's doing it b/c he that's the way to hold on to me - not because he desires me. Now I'm turning down sex!

I honestly can see spending my life with this guy who makes me laugh, adores me, supports me and wants me to have his babies. But there's also this suspicion in me that he will stop having sex with me altogether once I marry him and give him a couple of kids.

I don't know what I should do, if I should continue distancing myself from him or...? Ugh, I could go on and on. Of course there are many aspects that I can't fit into this already long post. I am a worrier maybe I am making a mountain out of a mole hill?

likeanyother
I don’t know AAGirl, I don’t have any experience with older men but it seems as though it probably has something to do with his age. I remember hearing somewhere that as people age and their libido declines, they need more visual stimulation to get excited. Maybe some lingerie is in order? Watch porn together? It’s also probably related to simply having differing sex drives. It’s always hot in the beginning but now that you’ve “settled in” you’re finding out that you don’t necessarily match up. If you really want to spend the rest of your life with him it’s probably advisable to work out some sort of solution, which may turn out to be you giving yourself some lovin’ when you’re horny and he’s not. Who knows, maybe seeing you all hot will get him in the mood.

Anyway, I actually have a quite opposite dilemma, the sex life with my boyfriend is great, but our future is grim. Despite lots of past problems, we’re really in love and things are good, UNTIL we talk about the future, which is where we don’t match up. My boyfriend has held the philosophy, since before we were even together, that marriage is basically a bad thing. He says that people inevitably change as time passes and that marriage almost always turns in a co-dependent mess. I can’t help but admit he’s right, most marriages end in divorce, and those that don’t are often unhappy and probably should end.

I understand that… but at the same time, we've been together for a year and half now and it feels so weird to me to not even have that as an option. I’m a total feminist, but I can’t help but be overcome by the fear that if we stay together as boyfriend-girlfriend with no real commitment he’ll just end up leaving me for… yeah finish the thought. dry.gif

Has anyone else dealt with this with their significant other? Should I just take it as it comes and not worry about the future? Just curious as to others’ thoughts on the subject…
AAGirl
Hey LAO,

Thanks for responding to my post. I've thought about lingerie but I think it may just make him feel more pressured. We've done the porn thing and probably will again... At this point I'm just steering clear of the subject and am trying to focus on my personal goals. I think if things don't change at the one year mark I'll have to end the relationship b/c I don't think it would be wise to marry when I'm not sexually satisfied.

If anyone else has words of wisdom I would love to hear.

In terms of your bf not wanting to get married I have plenty of experience in that department. When I was 24 I met a guy who I spent the next nine years with. He was a great bf, my best friend and we had a fairly successful company together. His parents were divorced (and never remarried) while my parents are still married. When I was younger I really didn't care much about marriage and kids, my bf was against it. He would say he didn't need a piece of paper to show he loves me, marriage is an institution, blah blah blah. When we hit year four or so I realized I actually did want to get married. I realized that I did believe in the idea of sticking it out w/someone through thick and thin. My parents had many rocky years but I saw them emerge with a deep love for each other and the comfort of knowing they will be supported and loved despite fucking up every now and again. Beautiful thing, right? So, I told the bf that wanting to get married was normal - all societies have some kind of ceremony that symbolizes when two people love each other and want to show that love to their community and I wanted to do that with him. But more than ceremony I wanted, what I felt, was a higher level of commitment. I felt that his fear of failure and divorce was stunting the growth of our relationship. Believe it or not he finally agreed to go to therapy (at five years into the relationship). After like three sessions he decided he was comfortable with the idea of marriage. I was stunned, that was WAY too easy.

So I waited. Everyone said that he would propose - my family and friends loved him and believed there was no way he would risk losing me. He finally proposed when we had been together for six years. He was nervous and uncomfortable, I got the feeling that he was only doing it b/c he felt he had to. He stuttered and apologized for not having a ring. I said yes. He said he would get me a ring. I told him not to worry about it, it didn't matter. But he insisted. And I waited. Again. No ring.

When we had been together for eight years I still hadn't received a ring (which stung, not b/c I needed a rock but b/c he promised but never delivered) but we started talking dates. We decided to get married the next summer. We were driving up to my family's summer home to make arrangements for the wedding and I said, "I just have a feeling this isn't the right time to plan a wedding." And he said, "okay." That was it. Wrong answer. After eight years and some odd months the last thing I wanted him to say was okay. I wanted him to say, "we've been through so much trying to get to this place, we're doing it!" But he couldn't b/c I don't think he ever wanted to get married. He was only doing it for me. And, ultimately, that wasn't enough for me.

I believe in marriage but I don't believe in divorce, which is why at 36 and having had several marriage proposals I am still not married. I'm only doing it once and once I do it I'm staying in through thick and thin, through all the fuck ups and, more than likely, infidelities. I understand that people change - thank god they do or life would be boring. And people aren't perfect so I don't expect that but I do expect someone who is as serious about the commitment of marriage as I am.

LAO, I don't know how old you are but seriously consider how much time you want to invest w/someone who has different values than you concerning family. I don't regret spending nine years w/the ex but I do kinda wish it was only like four years. When we broke up I felt foolish. It was like a divorce but, thankfully, not a divorce.

If you think that not having the option of marriage is a drag it sounds to me that you would like to get married some day. I would imagine that inkling you're having today will grow stronger as you get older and want more stability in your life. I am not a husband hunter but I believe in allowing space in my life to meet someone who may jive w/me enough to get married. Maybe I'll end up alone but that will be okay, I like myself. I would rather be with me and with the possibility of the kind of marriage I want than waiting for a guy to come around (again) or cornering a guy w/the passage of time (ugh, never again). If you decide you want to get married set a date in your mind of how long you'll wait to see if he comes around (don't tell him though) and stick to it.

One more thing, you obviously aren't in a place in which you're going to leave the man you love b/c of his not wanting to get married. But take it from someone who has been there: dig deep over the next year or two that you are with him, examine what you want in life, get comfortable with the idea of being independent and/or single (i.e. make sure you have a life!) Wanting to get married or getting married does not defeat being a feminist but renouncing a part of yourself that you believe in to be with a man will.

Phew, writing that was cathartic!

Btw, your bf saying marriage is a "co-dependent mess" is kinda ridiculous. What relationship isn't at least a little messy or have elements of co-dependence? It's the nature of the beast!

Stepping off my soapbox now.

Good luck!

P.S. My bf said to me, "that guy fucked up, he should have married you." I was single for three years before I met my guy but totally worth the wait to hear a man I love say that with sincerity.
geekchickknits
QUOTE
what happened to the guy who fucked for hours and now barely touches me but once every week or two?


AAGirl - In my last relationship my sex drive was WAY higher than my boyfriend's. At first, because we weren't living together we'd have sex every time we saw each other, but then once we were living together, and spending a lot of time together, if I wasn't insistent, sometimes we wouldn't have sex for weeks! Now, it may not be the sexiest idea, but we found that worked best for us was a sex schedule - every other day. That way, if someone REALLY wasn't feeling it, it wouldn't be a big deal, because we would know it would be happening in a day or two. Also, sometimes he'd just not be into intercourse and just go down on me (which he was brilliant at) and a lot of the time that would end up getting him in the mood for more!

LAO, my experience has been that if a guy doesn't want to commit in that way - they won't.
Mr Pugs
I think I'm going to be the first man in the world to say that sex is overrated....Don't get me wrong, I love it and have a pretty healthy libido, but if I meshed completely with a girl and my only concern was our libidos don't match up, it wouldn't be that big of a deal. In all honesty, as we all age, we'll hit a certain point where sex just isn't the big issue it is when we are young. Those are the days you hope you mesh well and enjoy spending time with someone. We all age, get wrinkly and become less attractive. I think to truly enjoy someones company far outweighs the libido mismatch. LMP and I have a small libido mismatch, if she's fired up and I'm not, she breaks out the Hitachi. Sometimes this gets me fired up and then we have sex, sometimes we don't. I don't care if she takes care of herself, same as she doesn't care if I take care of myself. I could be way off, but I have romantic ideas of growing old with LMP and spending time doing nothing with her....
shinyx3
AA Girl, I think you are right to be concerned as sex seem to be a really important thing in your life. If you would not be happy married to someone that is so different in the sex drive than you i believe you are wise to examine that closely. I also think you have very wise words for LAO. Which in some way is the same as the advice you give yourself. Examine what you want out of a committed relationship and make a decision as to what you can happily live with and what you can not.

Pugs, you LMP seem to have a very strong relationship and have already made the decisions about what you both need and can happily live with in a long term future. But I think there are really different ideas and feelings for every one as to what is needed to remain happy and fully committed.

I am married to a man 18 years my senior. We have an 8mo old baby and yes, our sex life is much less than it was when we were dating. However, I have to say that i expected this and although i would be happy with much more frequent sex, it is wonderful and very fulfilling when we have it and i am ok with this. (i do hold some hope that it will get more frequent when we are not as busy with the baby though) i also understand that the age difference is enough to impact our relationship as if you look back 18 yrs your can see what a difference that time frame makes in your views, ideas, things you like, things that are important to you, etc. we both have to be aware of this and realize that it is there and that makes it much to recognize when we are having an age related issue. We also have generational idea differences. But these are all things that for us, we have decided and are committed to dealing with and sticking out the rough spots of. So really what i am trying to say is that each person involved in a long term/possible long term relationship has to decide what they can happily live with, and go from there.

ok, that was rather long and rambling. i'm done now.
dusty
AAGirl, I think you have a serious problem if you're not 'allowed' to talk about it.
roseviolet
AAGirl, I totally understand where your boyfriend is coming from. When I was going through that, part of the problem was stress. I think when your boyfriend says that it'll get better if you don't talk about it so much, he's really trying to say that the way you two are talking about this issue is making him feel like a failure ... and that isn't a very sexy feeling to have. That doesn't mean you can't talk about it, but you may need to change the way you talk about it. Frankly, you'll probably have to prop up his self esteem a bit. Tell him that you want to spend time with him. Tell him he's funny or smart or whatever. Be affectionate, but let him know that you love him for much much more than sex. I know it sounds cheesy, but it's really important.

I think foreplay is going to need to start long before you enter the bedroom. He says he's stressed out about work. Well, help him cut back on the stress in his life. Run some errands for him. Cook dinner for him (nothing fancy & "romantic" - just something simple & comforting). Lastly, you should take him out and get him to do other things that will get his mind off of work and all of that stress. Don't just watch TV together. Instead, do something that will get you to interact and talk together. Go bowling or to an art gallery or something - whatever you can do to get you talking and reconnected. Hell, sometimes I feel more connected with my husband if we just go to the grocery store together! There are lots of simple, casual ways you can hang out together and become closer mentally and spiritually ... which will lead to you being closer physically.

I don't think lingerie is the answer at all. As you say, that'll just put more pressure on him. Right now, sex is a Big Problem in his mind. I think it'll be better if you make sex feel more casual and natural - something that he can choose to do because it's fun & because he loves you, not something he has to do because he's afraid you might leave him. He might not be so interested multi-hour fuck sessions anymore, but a fun, casual, 5 minute quickie could be doable right now.

I think the sex schedule thing is a good tool for some people, but it doesn't work for everyone. Sometimes when you have a low libido, it's easy to forget that sex can be fun and enjoyable. A little reminder can get you back into the habit and a sex schedule can help with that. But if he's feeling stressed and pressured, be careful with this. You don't want sex to seem like yet another chore to add onto his list. However, he may be open to having sex at least once a week. A goal like that - just 10 minutes dedicated to eachother - is pretty simple and, if you appraoch it properly, he may be willing to give this a try in order to make your bond stronger. But again ... you have to be careful! Having a low libido sucks ass. You feel like a freak and a failure. If you want this situation to improve, you need to give him some reassurance and love. Don't pander to him or talk down to him. Instead, lift him up! Remind him - and yourself - what you like about your relationship.
nickclick
QUOTE(Mr Pugs @ Apr 15 2008, 07:54 AM) *
I think to truly enjoy someones company far outweighs the libido mismatch.

sex drives come (no pun intended) and go, and all sorts of factors can dictate. but being with someone who is supportive and all the other things you mention, AAGirl, that's a find! now use the suggestions from other busties and find a way to address the situation. if he's the great guy you say he is, he'll be open to the conversation. good luck!
AAGirl
I love this site. What great feedback! I thank you all for taking the time to address my issue.

At this point I'm hesitant to bring up a sex schedule. I don't particularly like the idea of scheduled sex, although I do like the idea of once every few days that way if one of us isn't into it we know it's coming around again soon, as geekchickknit mentioned. Kinda brilliant. We are going on vacation soon and I hope things will be more relaxed about the subject, perhaps I'll broach the schedule then.

It's not that I can't talk to him about it, I can and do. It's just the talking makes him feel more pressured. Roseviolet, your advice was really sound. I've actually never thought it from that point of view before and it makes sense. He has mentioned that he feels like a failure. He makes me tea every morning, cooks dinner a couple of times a week, smiles every time he sees me, uses his nickname for me as a password so he has a reminder of me every day at work and today picked up toilet paper to "gain brownie points," as he put it. I was coming from the perspective that all these little things he was doing was to make up for not having sex - in a bad way. It seemed like he was placating me. But after reading your response I felt a little shitty for having thought so poorly of him. I really should make more of an effort to get him out of his stressful state of mind and having a talk or a big ol' pout about not fucking isn't going to cut it.

I always looked at having a raging libido as a bit of a curse but one that I wore like a badge. I never considered that having a low libido would make someone feel insecure. I always thought the person w/the lower libido has all the power. Your comments have made me re-examine my thoughts towards my libido and my man's.

As far as libido growing dim as you grow older, I say, bring it on! I look forward to that happening. I went through a phase in my late twenties in which I thought my libido finally became normal and I was so relieved. But then it came back with a vengeance.

Thank you all! I will try to stay positive and see if my love and I can make it work.

AAGirl
On more thing for now...

shinyx3, my parents are 17 years apart and have been together for 40 years now.

Let love rule!
beck
AAGirl, he sounds like a cutie. can i just second mr pugs and recommend toys?

my bf and i are sometimes out of synch libido-wise (mine is higher), and also just the times of day we are horny (i like first thing in the morning, just woken up sex, or going to bed early sex - he takes ages to surface in the mornings and tends to get in the mood at the weekends at the point when we're showered, fed, and i'm ready to go out and do stuff, and sex at night keeps him awake for hours afterwards, whereas i fall right asleep)

But i find that if i keep the itch scratched (with toys or whatever i'm in the mood for), i don't get all grouchy when it's been a while, and so it isn't such an issue. it's different than sex with a partner but lots of fun in its own right.

Oh, and make sure you try to maintain non-sexual physical contact so you keep that bond - lots of snuggling and holding hands. But let him know there's no pressure to take it further.
roseviolet
QUOTE(AAGirl @ Apr 16 2008, 12:29 AM) *
I always looked at having a raging libido as a bit of a curse but one that I wore like a badge. I never considered that having a low libido would make someone feel insecure. I always thought the person w/the lower libido has all the power. Your comments have made me re-examine my thoughts towards my libido and my man's.


Oh, it DEFINITELY makes you feel insecure. Just think of all of the sexual images and messages in the world. They're all over TV and the internet. Sex sex sex. All of these people talking like sex is the biggest, most important thing on the planet! Well, when you have a low libido, these things just make you feel worse. It doesn't make you feel like you're in a position of power; it makes you feel a total absence of power. It seems like everyone on the planet is having sex all the time & that you're a freak because you don't feel those happy tingles anymore. And then sex seems like this Huge Imposing Thing. Sex starts to seem too big, too important, too stressful. There's so much pressure to perform ... and how can you possibly relax and enjoy yourself when all of that is storming around in your head? And when you just don't feel those happy tingles anymore, how on earth do you fake it? It's really truly terrible. I know I felt like a terrible freak when I was going through this. You can't talk to anyone about it because they'll tell you that you're frigid or recoil in horror - confirming your freakish nature. I imagine this is much worse when you're a guy because the world just expects you to want sex all the time, even when your body isn't compliant (Viagra, anyone?).

It's obvious that he wants to make you happy. That's why he's doing all of these little things for you. He's trying to remind you that he loves you and he wants you to stay ... and that there are tons of other things to value in a relationship besides sex. He wants you to accept him for who his is - flaws and all. And whether he knows how to vocalize it or not, he wants you to relax so that he can relax. Will sex ever be as frantic and long-lasting as it was in the beginning? Well, not exactly. There may be occasional times when that comes back, but I have a feeling it will only happen when he feels relaxed, secure, and very close with you emotionally.

Just so you know, I was only able to conquer my sexual problems when I dealt with my mental and emotional issues. I went to therapy to deal with all of my stress and depression. I found a man with whom I could really talk about my deeper issues. And eventually, I started taking Prozac. It's funny because everyone says that Prozac kills your sex drive, but mine came back on the 'Zac! All because - for the first time in years - I started to feel some control over my life. I felt happier and more secure in myself and I really started to love and care for myself for the first time in ages. So even though the Prozac kept me from having orgasms, I still managed to crave sex more than I had in years. Kinda freaky, I know, but that shows that for some of us, sex has to start on a mental ane emotional level before it can become physical.
Mr Pugs
Well spoken Rose....Kudos
AAGirl
Thanks again Roseviolet!

Tonight I suggested going out for dinner. He talked about work for most of the evening. I had a bad day and so did he but I suggested we get off the work topic. We got home and had a really nice hug and a wrestling match and the intimacy of that was certainly good enough for me at this point. The poor guy is exhausted. He looks haunted. At dinner he said it hurt him that he hurt me and it was the last thing he wanted to do and I should do whatever I want that will make me happy (re: spending less time together, end of the honeymoon, me doing what I did before I met him so I put less expectations into the relationship). That made me cry. He's so sweet.

Anyway, I took parts of the advice I've been getting here and suggested that we have a good hug w/a little bit of touching every other day - whether we feel like it or not - to try to regain a sense of intimacy. I said a "no-pressure hug." I asked him if that would make him feel uncomfortable and he said no so we'll see how that shakes out.

He keeps saying that he just wants to get through this month - it's a tough one at work. But I've heard that before so I think it's just a matter of coming to terms that the honeymoon phase really is over combined w/me trying to be more understanding of the low libido.

Roseviolet, I do think that it's not just stress but is also related to how he views sex. I've tried to get him to be more open w/me on his views towards sex but he always says it's just the stress. I'm observant enough to realize that there is something more going on there. A few weeks ago I vindictively stopped "objectifying" him - stopped admiring his body, stopped patting his ass, etc. And he seems responsive and I am pretty sure it's b/c of what you mentioned before about his wanting to know his value goes beyond his penis. Tonight I said, I'm sorry if I objectified you too much, I did it b/c I like it when you do it to me. And he told me to stop, I was being a girl. That made me laugh. Being a girl = examining too deeply or, perhaps, talking too much.

Need to remember not to talk down to him or make him feel like he is a victim or lame. Super good advice.

Shhhh, just do it, don't talk about it. That's the message I'm getting. But then again, I may be examining it too much!

Beck and Mr Pugs, I have toys, I take care of my business. Not in his presence though. One time I masturbated in bed w/him and he said he felt like I was "rubbing it in his face" that he didn't want to have sex. And another time he was going to bed and asked what I was going to do and I said, read and masturbate. And he told me that made him feel guilty so I don't masturbate around him anymore. That's part of what I meant in the initial post about feeling like our sex life (and my sexuality) has been taken hostage. But I am trying to look at this from the low libido perspective now (thanks to Roseviolet) so I don't feel resentment. I can happily report that we hold hands all the time - from going to work in the morning, to walking down the street, to hanging out on the couch. And he tells me he loves me, that I'm pretty and cuddles w/me all the time.

Thanks all!

PS He's sleeping now and I can tell he's having nightmares. I wish there was something I could do for him.
AAGirl
So all the good will and hope I was feeling is slowly draining out of me. I feel like I'm being punished - you mentioned sex! That's another three days of not having sex! And you better not come off like you feel rejected b/c that's not sexy and will cost you another three days without. It's been over three weeks. I feel sad and rejected. I suggested therapy and he said we don't need it.

FUCK!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I don't know anymore... sad.gif
LoveMyPugs
AAGirl - I haven't visited this thread lately so I'm not completely caught up on your situation. It sounds like a mess. I'm sure you feel terrible. Just take care of yourself during all of this. To me it sounds like he needs therapy. Being in a relationship during stressful times in life is sometimes like having a second job. I know how I get at semester ends. I get focused on school and I really do put Mr. Pug on the back burner. I know he understands this but it makes me sad inside. Right now I'm swamped with school work, I'm running for vice president of our Engineering Club at school and I also have an interview on friday for a summer internship. On top of all this my stuttering is through the roof and I'm nervous it will show badly in my interview. I'm doing all the progressive relaxation techniques my speech therapist taught me. They at least help me fall asleep at night. I try to remember to touch Mr. Pug's often, tell him I love him, let him hold me when he's reaches for me, be in the moment with him even though sometimes they feel like few and far between. Weekends are ours and I try not to plan anything. It's hard. Life sucks sometimes. Good luck.

Got class,

Pugs
roseviolet
AAGirl, I'm sorry things haven't gotten better. sad.gif

In my opinion, if one person in a relationship thinks it's time to go to counseling, then it's time to go to counseling. And if the other person in the relationship disagrees, then that's just more proof that it's time to go to counseling. Obviously you two are not seeing eye-to-eye on a very important subject. If you can't handle the problem alone, then it makes sense to get some professional help - a mediator who can help you both be happier. If he refuses to go with you, then maybe you should listen to all of those advice columnists out there & just go by yourself. Hopefully in time he'll open up and agree to accompany you to some sessions.

I think a lot of people who've never been to counseling before think it is somehow shameful to do so. It's sad that a negative stigma has been placed on something that can be so helpful.
nickclick
(((AAgirl))) As usual, I agree with RV!

I went to counseling without my boyfriend, and I started talking about all the stuff HE wasn't doing for me, HE wasn't into that I was, HE didn't want from life. The therapist helped me redirect and be proactive about helping myself be happy. For me, it was leaving him, but that's not the moral of my story. The moral is that even though my relationship was less than fulfilling, going to therapy alone did help me see things more clearly.
chickenlittle
(delurking)

AAGirl, it may be helpful to see a counselor even if you go on your own, as nickclick notes. i've done the same on past occasions, and i've certainly felt more centered- and more conscious of my own part in the situation, and choices that I otherwise wouldn't have considered. i think it's always helpful to have objective feedback.
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